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  1. #16
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    Thumbs down Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalNuke
    In fact, it's these negative ideas that keep certain people where they are. They feel sorry for themselves and believe there is no way out. There is a way, but it requires them to work. Some people just can't accept that life isn't about getting a good hand but doing the best with the hand you're given. They feel sorry for themselves and just accept that they have a bad life without trying to change it. That's the problem with society. We shouldn't pretend the problem isn't there, but we should realize that the mentality of those in "bad" situations is part of the problem, if not the main part.
    This is a perfect example of pure ignorance. People that live in the innercity don't lose hope the day they are born, but after years of living in violent neighboorhoods along with going to schools that are grossly underfunded and have torn textbooks that are older than them, then they lose hope. Unfortunately most kids living in the innercity see sports and entertainment as a means of escape instead of education, and that is the main problem.

  2. #17
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by fireman_x
    This is a perfect example of pure ignorance. People that live in the innercity don't lose hope the day they are born, but after years of living in violent neighboorhoods along with going to schools that are grossly underfunded and have torn textbooks that are older than them, then they lose hope. Unfortunately most kids living in the innercity see sports and entertainment as a means of escape instead of education, and that is the main problem.

    They lose hope becuase of many reasons. One is that poor families tend to have lots of children... and don't care properly for their children. This is seen the most in african-american families. In the past 30 years we've seen the destruction of the black family. Men don't take responsibility, women continue popping out children, and this country has created an enviornment where its eveyones fault for your misfortune but your own.

    My best friend is an example of this not being true for everyone. He grew up in Queens, NY... busted his ass in school... and got out of there and went to a university. He had no father.... his mother has recently passed... but he is the last person in the world to blame anyone for his screw ups. Not the white man, not the system.


    The largest reason of this "wealth gap" is not due to rich whitie keeping people down. Its the massive immigrant population coming in, and their population growth once they're here. School systems in California cannot keep up with this growth, nor can medical systems and the average taxpayer.

  3. #18
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Not to mention the drug problems in the inner-city. Kids look at the drug dealers riding around in Mercedes and BMWs and then see the guys working hard at McDonalds to get thru school and make it out of the getto and it's an easy choice for them. Gee, I can sell drugs and have everything now, Or I can work my ass off and maybe get that "stuff" in ten or twenty years. Kids have a big problem with wanting everything now and not realizing that you have to work for it, their role models are for the most part flawed. Either they are athletes or rap artists who got their money quickly and spend it even faster or it's drug dealers. Until they see that money doesn't come easy and requires hard work, there will always be this problem.
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  4. #19
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by liteman
    Not to mention the drug problems in the inner-city. Kids look at the drug dealers riding around in Mercedes and BMWs and then see the guys working hard at McDonalds to get thru school and make it out of the getto and it's an easy choice for them.
    Growing up in southern california, i see drugs as being a worse problem and far more common among middle class people in their teens and early 20's. Drugs are everywhere though, and history has shown its something we cannot really stop.


    Gee, I can sell drugs and have everything now, Or I can work my ass off and maybe get that "stuff" in ten or twenty years. Kids have a big problem with wanting everything now and not realizing that you have to work for it, their role models are for the most part flawed. Either they are athletes or rap artists who got their money quickly and spend it even faster or it's drug dealers. Until they see that money doesn't come easy and requires hard work, there will always be this problem.

    Role models are also a huge problem. Kids see rappers and basketball stars as who the want to be when they're older and in return... they dont study and set themselves up for failure.

  5. #20
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew LB
    Role models are also a huge problem. Kids see rappers and basketball stars as who the want to be when they're older and in return... they dont study and set themselves up for failure.
    LOL, a bunch of us old farts play basketball at the local Y twice a week. We're your typical so-so players, ie better than the average Joe walking the streets but not as good as the local high school players (primarily due to lack of conditioning ). One of the short-timers over the summer was a kid who was a freshman in college. He had signed up for classes following a music major, but his dad wanted him to consider pre-law. Since one of our regulars is a lawyer, he wanted this guy to talk to his kid about law school.

    Even among our group, this kid would have been one of the last ones chosen had we "picked teams". Nonetheless, he declared that while he was following the music major curriculum, he was still holding out hope of making the NBA. Stupid stuff like this I can not make up. Other than being <6', playing no defense, having no shot, no strength, etc., yeah, maybe he can make the NBA.

    Dreams and goals are great, a necessity even, but a grasp on the real world is equally important. Take football, basketball, hockey, and all the other professional sports. Add up all the players. It's a pretty small number in the overall scheme and anyone planning to make a living at it who isn't already being pursued by scouts should rethink their career plans.

  6. #21
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    There's also a male/female gap opening wider amongst the same minorities. There was an interesting article about this in the paper the other week. I'll try and find a link for it if I can.

    Basically, it said that here in the UK, for every black male at university there are TWO in prison. You might instinctively blame the usual things like poor schools, prevalence of drugs, broken homes etc etc, but surely it's the same environment for the girls too. So why is it that for every black guy at university there are SIXTEEN black girls? The men are just getting left further and further behind right throughout the education system and into the job market.

  7. #22
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by myv65
    Vihs,

    Show me a plan to moves people from poverty to self-sustenance and you can have my money. People talk of equal opportunity. I prefer to focus on equal effort. Education is a big part of this. We spend more per pupil than most other nations, yet we have loads of drop-outs and underachievers. Why is this? School quality is a prime issue, but school quality involves far more than money spent and personnel hired.

    I like what Cosby has said on this topic this year. People need to quite pointing the finger of blame at everyone else and start looking in the mirror.

    I don't mind tax money to provide free education, but I'd appreciate people taking advantage of the opportunity presented rather than pissing away the gift.

    Yeah, it's an oversimplification on my part, but seems far too many people "value" all the wrong things. School is un-cool. Being smart is less attractive than being a playa.

    Even with education, wealth is not guaranteed. Some folks have really good paying jobs, yet never save a dime. At least three of my sisters could be poster-children for the "too foolish to save, gonna have to live on SSI" campaign. Building wealth means saving a portion of what you earn, no matter your income. Very, very few people truly must spend every dime on necessities of life in this country. IMO, the ranks of the poor outnumber the ranks of the low paid.

    I grow weary of social programs that do nothing beyond maintaining the status quo. I grow weary of people who do not seize the opportunities afforded them to get a leg up in life.

    However politically incorrect, it is largely a cultural issue. Until education and hard work gain higher priority entire cultures will tend to suffer. Show me a program that successfully changes that before asking for more programs.
    Very well put.

  8. #23
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew LB

    My best friend is an example of this not being true for everyone. He grew up in Queens, NY... busted his ass in school... and got out of there and went to a university. He had no father.... his mother has recently passed... but he is the last person in the world to blame anyone for his screw ups. Not the white man, not the system.

    This is what I'm talking about, making the most of life. Sure it's easier for me to go to college than this guy, but that's the way of life. I know people who have it "easier" than me and accept it. I challenge myself to beat them in life even though they started with more. This is the nature of capitalism and it makes everyone want to achieve more rather than the "status quo".

  9. #24
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by liteman
    Not to mention the drug problems in the inner-city. Kids look at the drug dealers riding around in Mercedes and BMWs and then see the guys working hard at McDonalds to get thru school and make it out of the getto and it's an easy choice for them. Gee, I can sell drugs and have everything now, Or I can work my ass off and maybe get that "stuff" in ten or twenty years. Kids have a big problem with wanting everything now and not realizing that you have to work for it, their role models are for the most part flawed. Either they are athletes or rap artists who got their money quickly and spend it even faster or it's drug dealers. Until they see that money doesn't come easy and requires hard work, there will always be this problem.
    The truth is that if drugs were legalized the value of the drug market would drop signifigantly, thus reducing the benefits if participating in that trade. I would like to see that happen because even if the use of drugs increased (which I highly doubt would happen since it's still incredibly easy to get stuff) you wouldn't have to worry about a crackhead stealing your deck out of you car to fund their habit. The Libertarians have gone into a bit of detail as to how legalizing drugs would be good for the US. http://www.issues2000.org/Celeb/Libe...arty_Drugs.htm

  10. #25
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by fireman_x
    The truth is that if drugs were legalized the value of the drug market would drop signifigantly, thus reducing the benefits if participating in that trade. I would like to see that happen because even if the use of drugs increased (which I highly doubt would happen since it's still incredibly easy to get stuff) you wouldn't have to worry about a crackhead stealing your deck out of you car to fund their habit. The Libertarians have gone into a bit of detail as to how legalizing drugs would be good for the US. http://www.issues2000.org/Celeb/Libe...arty_Drugs.htm
    If drugs were legalized they'd be FDA regulated and hence more expensive. There'd still be a drug underground and we'd still have the same problem. Addicts would still steal stuff, because the reason they must still is not because it's illegal, but because they have no money. Your logic is quite flawed.

  11. #26
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalNuke
    If drugs were legalized they'd be FDA regulated and hence more expensive. There'd still be a drug underground and we'd still have the same problem. Addicts would still steal stuff, because the reason they must still is not because it's illegal, but because they have no money. Your logic is quite flawed.
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  12. #27
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalNuke
    It can start with your doing if you wish. I personally do not give my time to inner-city kids. Do you?
    YES.

    Quote Originally Posted by Myv65
    Show me a plan to moves people from poverty to self-sustenance and you can have my money. People talk of equal opportunity. I prefer to focus on equal effort.
    You are "strawmanning" my argument. Read it again, and think about the meaning of my words. I never said I wanted your money. I wasn't arguing anything to do with tax dollars. If you've seen my posts in previous threads, I've often said that one "conservative" ideal that I hold is this one: "give a man a fish and he eats for one day, teach a man to fish and he eats fish for a lifetime". Tax dollars are not the answer, as the education system has clearly shown. Lack of education, and self-worth is the problem. And it's a downward spiral that is hard to get out of with the type of education some of these children get. I don't want your money, I want your time and effort.

  13. #28
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by Vihsadas
    YES.


    "give a man a fish and he eats for one day, teach a man to fish and he eats fish for a lifetime".
    Enlighten him further and he opens a seafood restaurant.

  14. #29
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalNuke
    Enlighten him further and he opens a seafood restaurant.
    Fair enough. That's the same ideal I preach to the kids I tutor.

  15. #30
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    Re: Study: Wealth gap widened for blacks, Latinos

    Quote Originally Posted by Enmore
    There's also a male/female gap opening wider amongst the same minorities. There was an interesting article about this in the paper the other week. I'll try and find a link for it if I can.

    Basically, it said that here in the UK, for every black male at university there are TWO in prison. You might instinctively blame the usual things like poor schools, prevalence of drugs, broken homes etc etc, but surely it's the same environment for the girls too. So why is it that for every black guy at university there are SIXTEEN black girls? The men are just getting left further and further behind right throughout the education system and into the job market.
    The US is in the same exact situation. College-educated black women are complaining that they can't find equal partners. Their choices are to "marry down" or marry another 'race'.

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