View Poll Results: #1 Reason Why Kerry lost the election

Voters
30. You may not vote on this poll
  • Youth Voter apathy

    2 6.67%
  • Paperless Voting Machines

    2 6.67%
  • Religion

    11 36.67%
  • THK - the gin soaked raisin eater

    1 3.33%
  • John the ambulance chaser

    1 3.33%
  • Swifties/IRS 527's

    4 13.33%
  • Gay marriage issue

    5 16.67%
  • Minority Swing voters

    0 0%
  • "Rock the Vote" activists

    0 0%
  • MM's f/911

    4 13.33%
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  1. #16
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangutan
    [*]Kerry was presented as an anti-Bush, not as Kerry the Leader
    That's the biggest reason by far right there. Had the Democrats run a stronger opponent to Bush, we'd be looking at a different president right now.
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  2. #17
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    That's the biggest reason by far right there. Had the Democrats run a stronger opponent to Bush, we'd be looking at a different president right now.
    I don't think Kerry necessarily isn't a strong-enough candidate. Rather, the aura that surrounded him was not one of a true opponent to Bush. For certain he could have been modelled in such a way, but that did not happen.

    Just to offer another perspective, I'd say it's the Democrats who have adequately convinced the Republican supporters that the Democrats are morally corrupt. It really is a bit of a shame, too, as I think it is not indicative of the masses who do continue supporting the Democratic party.

    The leaders shaping the Democratic party's image are to blame, IMHO. They've given the strong impression of supporting ideas which run counter to the feelings of many of their own traditional supporters. The obvious example here is the gay marriage bans which passed in 11 states, and all by far wider margins than Bush won those states. Heck, even Oregon, which went to Kerry, supported such a ban.

    The leaders of the Democratic party are simply farther out of touch with the typical citizen than the Republican party leaders. Mind you, that's saying something as I also feel the Republican leaders are a ways out of touch, too.

    I've said it before and will repeat it now. The Dems are continuing to lose ground in DC. Until they portray themselves as closer to the center the trend will continue. They need to make the Republican party appear the one so far from the middle. Sadly for them, they've opted to move ever farther away as evidenced by their rampant support of the likes of Michael Moore, Soros, et. al.
    I believe the problem lie in the fact that attitudes in this country in general have shifted. The Democrats are not the pot-smoking, anti-establishment hippies that people like to think they are. "Liberalness" has moderated itself since the Late 60's/Early 70's. Yet concurrently, Republicanism also moderated somewhat. I'll leave my personal opinion out of why I believe it happened, but the populace started to shift as well. The Republican masses swelled and in doing so, they began a reversal of the moderation. While moving farther right, they continued to gain support. What we are seeing now are the results of that spectral shift rightward in both the political parties and their supporters. It's not really that the Democrats are "Left", just that they are more left than the Republicans and a good many other people. In truth, the Democrats hardly qualify as leftists in the grand scheme of politics. The Greens represent a moderate left while the Democrats are slightly-right moderates. The Republicans are even more to the right with the Constitution Party being still more rightist.
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  3. #18
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Indecisiveness and too many stances on the same issue was his downfall IMO. Edwards didn't help. If Kerrys ego could have been deflated a bit maybe a stronger running mate would have been better. I think it's fair to say Kerry didn't want to be upstaged, so he picked a submissive. I say that because I don't feel Edwards was very aggressive. I never did "know" Kerry.
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  4. #19
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Orang,

    I think the distinction between what we've posted is in the politicians vs the populace.

    My point would be that both the Democrats' and the Republicans' (leadership) have moved away from where the majority of the population is. Whether this is purely because the population is more to the right, the parties have moved, or some combination of the two is largely irrelevant. FWIW, I also think the general population has shifted a bit to the right.

    If the Dems stand still or move slightly left and the Republicans stand still or move slightly right and the population does not move, then there is no change. If, however, the population moves a bit to the right, then the Dems fall farther from center.

    Again, I would emphasize that it isn't necessarily the everyday local politicians. It's the elite few of each party that get their mugs in front of the camera and the "caretakers" who mold the image of the big time politicians ala Bush and Kerry.

    Allowing folks like Michael Moore to run loose with the apparent blessing of the high power Dems hurt them. Same goes for folks like Ann Coulter on the right. The difference, in my eyes, is that you don't see high ranking Republicans applauding Ann (or Rush, or any other right-wing flame thrower) the way that the Dems embraced MM and others like him.

    Anyway, I think the Dems are more responsible for the obvious alienation towards their party than anyone else. What's ironic and comical (to a generally conservative guy like myself) is that they seem convinced that it couldn't possibly be so. After all, all the folks they hang out with affirm their views. They've got the Hollywood crowd all telling them how wonderful they're doing (all while losing dozens of seats in the House and Senate over the past decade). The folks that control that party have it in a death spiral that they don't even seem to see.

    The only reason that gives me cause for alarm is thus: The more whacked out the Dems get vs the average everyday Joe, the more whacked out the Republicans can get without being brought back into line. As long as a majority sees the Democrats as farther out of touch, the Republicans will continue to gain support. I support a lot of classical Republican ideals, but I see a potential for things to go awry if their power continues to grow unabated.

    Why, after the popularity of Bill Clinton, can't the Dems figure out that candidates who are fairly centric and have good stage presence do so much better than those tagged as farther left?

  5. #20
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    I think it was a combination of religious values, the NRA, and the lack of decisiveness.
    Brian

  6. #21
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    I vote other:

    Kerry lost because, while there were hordes of anti-Bush folks, a good chunk of them were not pro-Kerry. I'm sure the rain kept some anti-Bush folk away, but I have no evidence to back it up.

    I totally agree: Bush has done stuff that I don't agree with. There are alternatives, but Kerry didn't offer them. He offered goals, not plans. Winning the war: I think Bush has that plan too, which doesn't involve handing the US over to the UN (once again the winner of the "most worthless organization" award). I NEVER, EVER support the UN. It blathers on about how to negotiate, lays out laws that it doesn't enforce, and then slams the US. F*ck that. The UN lacks balls...how the hell can it lead worth a damn?

  7. #22
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    #1 Reason Kerry lost? 150,000 people in Ohio voted the wrong way. Do you realize that if Ohio had gone kerry, Bush would've won the popular vote by over 3 million and lost the election? Then you would have heard the right wing bitch about the validity of the electoral college.
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  8. #23
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    There were a few states closer than Ohio. They wouldn't have changed the election result though.

  9. #24
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by liteman
    #1 Reason Kerry lost? 150,000 people in Ohio voted the wrong way. Do you realize that if Ohio had gone kerry, Bush would've won the popular vote by over 3 million and lost the election? Then you would have heard the right wing bitch about the validity of the electoral college.
    I wasn't thrilled with either candidate, and voted for Badnarik of course. That said, I'm glad Bush won. He garnered over half the popular vote and of course won the electoral college, that hasn't been accomplished since his daddy whooped up on another poor sap from Massachusetts by the name of Dukakis. I found it to be rather amusing that November 3 was Dukakis's birthday .
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  10. #25
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    I say the gay marriage issue. It's a huge issue with the conservatives and I think many turned out to vote just on that issue and voted for Bush to ensure that marriage stays heterosexual.
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  11. #26
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose1974
    I say the gay marriage issue. It's a huge issue with the conservatives and I think many turned out to vote just on that issue and voted for Bush to ensure that marriage stays heterosexual.
    I think that was the biggest issue, as well. A close second would have to be religion, which relates to the whole gay marriage issue. Morality was the #1 issue for voters this election. One thing I didn't see listed here that I heard on the news and found to be quite amusing is that people voted for Bush to basically spite the media, because of course they really never said much of anything positive about the guy. Those liberal media outlets sure have a way of underminding the voters who voted against their boy.
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  12. #27
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    I really think that what President Bush, showed indirectly was the moral integrity that he posses, he did not have to speak directly on it in his campagin, but it was evident that is one thing that the Democrats lacked.

    Teresa refering to people as "idiots" and "scumbags", all she came off as is a RICH, SNOOTY, person that looks down on the little people.

    The Democratic Party has pandered so much to the radical factions that, mainstream americans do not connect with the party any more. NO PLANS, NO VISION and NO DIRECTION for the country, just HATE the President Retroic. Thanks to M Moore and G Soros, I think they alienated more people with their BS.

    I do think that the Judges that tried to RAM this GAY Marriage stuff down the throats, showed how they would rather use the courts to win their battles rather than win at the Ballot Box.

    I hope the Democrats keep it up so in mid term elections the Republicans can make more gains in the house and Senate.
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  13. #28
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonG06
    I wasn't thrilled with either candidate, and voted for Badnarik of course. That said, I'm glad Bush won. He garnered over half the popular vote and of course won the electoral college, that hasn't been accomplished since his daddy whooped up on another poor sap from Massachusetts by the name of Dukakis. I found it to be rather amusing that November 3 was Dukakis's birthday .
    Mass. Senators... perhaps the democratic party is done with them for a while? The dems really need to nominate a person in touch with some of those 'red' states and counties. Otherwise they'll carry the NE & West coast and complain about all the red on the map again.
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  14. #29
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

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  15. #30
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    Re: #1 Reason why Kerry lost - Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by liteman
    #1 Reason Kerry lost? 150,000 people in Ohio voted the wrong way. Do you realize that if Ohio had gone kerry, Bush would've won the popular vote by over 3 million and lost the election? Then you would have heard the right wing bitch about the validity of the electoral college.
    Interesting and very narrow minded post on your part . By this analogy everyone who dissagrees with you or your view is automatically wrong ?
    If is not relevant in this situation .
    Sort of like , should have , could have and would have .

    Yes I would imagine that many would have bitched about the EC just as many have before us and many will after us . Still every Presidential candadite knows that there is the possibility of this happening . Would the bitching be justified ?

    The fact still remains that George W. Bush did carry Ohio .


    Chris
    Last edited by painthorse; 11-06-2004 at 11:45 AM.

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