View Poll Results: Should the Congress pass special legislation in an effort to restore the feeding tube

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  • Yes

    12 21.05%
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  1. #1
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    Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Should Congress pass special legislation in an effort to restore the feeding tube in Schiavo right-to-die case?
    Last edited by Hefner; 03-19-2005 at 07:53 PM.






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  2. #2
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Yes. And it will in the morning I believe. The case has become confused with contradiction and needs an objective look.

  3. #3
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Quote Originally Posted by jimzinsocal
    Yes. And it will in the morning I believe. The case has become confused with contradiction and needs an objective look.
    I believe so too. Aren't these knuckleheads the same people who cryout against "cruel and unusual punishment" when refering to death penalties? I suppose if the feel fine with starving someone to death, then maybe we should just starve those sentenced to death in a court of law, afterall this method of imposing death seems accpetable.




  4. #4
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    I wasn't aware until hearing details about this case that food is considered life support. I thought it meant heart pumping, dyalisis, artificial respiration and other fancy medical schtuff like that. Where's the ACLU to call starvation as cruel and unusual punishment?

    I suppose that without legislation, anyone wanting to off their spouse or kids could just yank the food tube.

    The hubby has a shaky story to boot... I just don't get that guy at all.

    A new way to handle death row inmates... don't feed 'em.

    I simply don't see the logic here.

  5. #5
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Anyone know if it is normal language in a living will to specify which forms of life support are to be used or not to be used? (such as feeding tubes)
    "It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach."
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  6. #6
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    ^^Yes. Check this out as a guide:

    http://www.abanet.org/aging/toolkit/tool2.pdf

  7. #7
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    It would have to depend on the wording of the bill, I would want this first and foremost given the utmost scrutiny, last thing I need is a bill worded in such a way that it makes the living wills null and void, and then each and everyone (living will) has to be federally reviewed before carrying out my wishes or my wifes wishes, this is definately a slippery slope that if worded the wrong way can do more harm than good.

    I know there was no document involved here, but remember if your word is given even without documentation, you can still be held responsible for your word.

    We don't know 100% that the discussion between these too happened and these were her wishes, but the last thing we need is the government telling us what to do with our loved ones, he is the next of kin just as I am for my wife, we've had the discussion and the papers are drawn up, but consider this, we suffer an auto accident (her parents are gone and mine too) we are both severly injured and no one to speak for us, the docters put us on life support, on of us has no chance of recovery, our documents are not readily available or we have no access to them, the one recovering tells the hospital to remove all artificial support, now what happens another bill? another federal review? Or do they get hooked up against their wishes? Because once their hooked up now it's time to go to court even with the living will.

    For an example only
    Last edited by kamikazee; 03-20-2005 at 01:19 AM.

  8. #8
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Quote Originally Posted by kamikazee
    It would have to depend on the wording of the bill, I would want this first and foremost given the utmost scrutiny, last thing I need is a bill worded in such a way that it makes the living wills null and void, and then each and everyone (living will) has to be federally reviewed before carrying out my wishes or my wifes wishes, this is definately a slippery slope that if worded the wrong way can do more harm than good.
    I agree to an extent. (obviously this paricular case I don't)

    I know there was no document involved here, but remember if your word is given even without documentation, you can still be held responsible for your word.
    Yes, but we're not talking about pulling the plug and possibly several minutes until on expires, we're talking about starvation and upto 2 WEEKS before expiration - if that doesn't seem cruel then what is?

    We don't know 100% that the discussion between these too happened and these were her wishes, but the last thing we need is the government telling us what to do with our loved ones, he is the next of kin just as I am for my wife, we've had the discussion and the papers are drawn up, but consider this, we suffer an auto accident (her parents are gone and mine too) we are both severly injured and no one to speak for us, the docters put us on life support, on of us has no chance of recovery, our documents are not readily available or we have no access to them, the one recovering tells the hospital to remove all artificial support, now what happens another bill? another federal review? Or do they get hooked up against their wishes? Because once their hooked up now it's time to go to court even with the living will.

    For an example only
    Except here we have a man who shortly after his wife's heart failure and hospitalization found another woman and had children with her, this step is a convienence move for him, IMO. What gets me is that the blood family (parents and siblings) of Terri are willing to take up the expense, and have the husband emancipated from any (let alone legal) obligations that he may have, I'm sorry but if my wife had something similar occur to her I wouldn't starve her to death, yes her condition would be upsetting to me (to say the least), however starving her to death would not even be a consideration, his attitude over the method is very benign and cold for someone who supposedly had love for her, h3ll it would be benign if it were a complete stranger.
    Last edited by Nobody1; 03-20-2005 at 01:34 AM.




  9. #9
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    "It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach."
    Franklin D. Roosevelt
    heat


  10. #10
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    ^^Heavy stuff.

  11. #11
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    She told her husband she wouldn't want this, so her wishes should be honored...

    but letting her starve to death probably what she wanted either, heavy sedation maybe?
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  12. #12
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    The ACLU finally gets involved!? They should've added we did not get involved with this until the public heard that the "life support" was a simple feeding tube.

    The left is a puzzling crowd, don't kill those on death row it's cruel and unusual punishment, just give them life sentences, or the best one--> we can rehabilitate them back into society. We just advocate killing those incapable of defending themselves, unable to say nary a word. Regardless, this guy Michael should rot in hell.

    http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/19/sc...ged/index.html

    The Senate met briefly Saturday for a procedural move and will reconvene Sunday afternoon at 2 p.m., about one hour after the House begins meeting.
    However, because most House Democrats object to intervening in the Schiavo matter, few are likely to show up for Sunday's special House session to vote, a House Democratic leadership aide said Saturday.
    "Most Democrats" (refering to the above quote) are spineless twits, they will take the time to attend a moveon rally, but not to vote on this --- one way or another. I guess not voting is the safe way for them.

    President Bush planned to leave his ranch in Crawford, Texas, for Washington late Sunday morning so he can be ready to sign any legislation passed, spokesman Scott McClellan said.

    "This is about defending life," McClellan said.
    You can say all the negatives you wish about him, but at least he sticks to his principles.
    Last edited by Nobody1; 03-20-2005 at 04:31 AM.




  13. #13
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Sticking to one's principles is a fickle value judgement. It's a statement often issued about those attributed with principles by those who agree with the principles perceived in the praised. Consider "One thing you can say about Hitler. He sure stuck by his principles." and see how well it sits.
    So, it seems there are those who fancy themselves better doctors than the ones appointed by the courts to examine Terry Schiavo. It seems there are those who are horrified at the thought of someone dying of hunger who has demonstrated no capability to recover cognitive capabilities. Yet, a daily average of approximately 21,000 babies dying within the first year of their life, individuals who do stand a chance of gaining or further developing cognitive abilities and, for some reason, none of them are the cause célébrée. Genocides are still committed on this planet and no one is observed putting red tape over their mouths for those victims. Something seems askew...welcome to the wonderful world of media-generated frenzy.
    Last edited by Robert3; 03-20-2005 at 05:31 AM.
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  14. #14
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Quote Originally Posted by kamikazee
    It would have to depend on the wording of the bill, I would want this first and foremost given the utmost scrutiny, last thing I need is a bill worded in such a way that it makes the living wills null and void, and then each and everyone (living will) has to be federally reviewed before carrying out my wishes or my wifes wishes, this is definately a slippery slope that if worded the wrong way can do more harm than good.
    This bill, from my understanding, would only apply to this Schiavo case.

    http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/19/sc...ged/index.html
    The compromise legislation applies only to the Schiavo case, lawmakers said.

    The bill would give jurisdiction to the U.S. District Court for the Middle District of Florida, which covers an area from the Georgia border on the northeast to south of Naples on the southwest coast.

    The court would be asked to "issue such declaratory and injunctive relief as may be necessary to protect the rights of Theresa Marie Schiavo under the Constitution and laws of the United States relating to the withholding or withdrawal of food, fluids or medical treatment necessary to sustain her life."
    Clearly this bill is aimed at this one case alone.

    One heavy situation. If one presumes the Schiavos discussed this issue and her wishes were truly to be left to die when any form of life support was required, they should have got that put into writing. For now all we have is the husband's word.

    Moral to the story: If you discuss this issue with your spouse get your wishes put into writing in a legally accepted document. Not fun, but it's necessary in this day and age.

    But we don't have that particular document in this case. It comes down to "He said - she said", and in this scenario the motives of individuals come into play. Michael Schiavo's motives appear to be suspect.

    I wonder why Mr. Schiavo can not accept a divorce and turning over guardianship to Terri's parents. Either he has something to lose, or he is indeed standing by his wife's wishes.
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  15. #15
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    Re: Should Congress pass special legislation in the Schiavo right-to-die case?

    Some info I found:

    --------------

    MYTH: Terri is PVS (Persistent vegetative state)
    FACT: The definition of PVS in Florida Statue 765.101:
    Persistent vegetative state means a permanent and irreversible condition of unconsciousness in which there is:

    (a) The absence of voluntary action or cognitive behavior of ANY kind.
    (b) An inability to communicate or interact purposefully with the environment.

    Terri's behavior does not meet the medical or statutory definition of persistent vegetative state. Terri responds to stimuli, tries to communicate verbally, follows limited commands, laughs or cries in interaction with loved ones, physically distances herself from irritating or painful stimulation and watches loved ones as they move around her. None of these behaviors are simple reflexes and are, instead, voluntary and cognitive. Though Terri has limitations, she does interact purposefully with her environment.

    MYTH: Terri does not need rehabilitation
    FACT: Florida Statute 744.3215 Rights of persons determined incapacitated:

    (1) A person who has been determined to be incapacitated retains the right
    (i) To receive necessary services and rehabilitation.

    This is a retained right that a guardian cannot take away. Additionally, it does not make exception for PVS patients. Terri has illegally been denied rehabilitation - as many nurses have sworn in affidavits.

    MYTH: Removal of food was both legal and court-ordered.
    FACT: The courts had only allowed removal of Terri's feeding tube, not regular food and water. Terri's husband illegally ordered this. The law only allows the removal of "life-prolonging procedures," not regular food and water:

    Florida Statute 765.309 Mercy killing or euthanasia not authorized; suicide distinguished. Nothing in this chapter shall be construed to condone, authorize, or approve mercy killing or euthanasia, or to permit any affirmative or deliberate act or omission to end life other than to permit the natural process of dying.

    MYTH: Many doctors have said that there is no hope for her.
    FACT: Dr. Victor Gambone testified that he visits Terri 3 times a year. His visits last for approximately 10 minutes. He also testified, after viewing the court videotapes at Terri’s recent trial, that he was surprised to see Terri’s level of awareness. This doctor is part of a team hand-picked by her husband, Michael Schiavo, shortly before he filed to have Terri’s feeding removed. Contrary to Schiavo’s team, 14 independent medical professionals (6 of them neurologists) have given either statements or testimony that Terri is NOT in a Persistent Vegetative State. Additionally, there has never been any medical dispute of Terri’s ability to swallow. Even with this compelling evidence, Terri’s husband, Michael Schiavo, has denied any form of therapy for her for over 10 years.

    Dr. Melvin Greer, appointed by Schiavo, testified that a doctor need not examine a patient to know the appropriate medical treatment. He spent approximately 45 minutes with Terri. Dr. Peter Bambakidis, appointed by Judge Greer, spent approximately 30 minutes with Terri. Dr. Ronald Cranford, also appointed by Schiavo and who has publicly labeled himself “Dr. Death”, spent less than 45 minutes examining and interacting with Terri.

    MYTH: This is just a family battle over money.
    FACT: In 1992, Terri was awarded nearly one million dollars by a malpractice jury and an out-of-court malpractice settlement which was designated for future medical expenses. Of these funds, less than $50,000 remains today. The financial records revealing how Terri’s medical fund money is managed are SEALED from inspection. Court records, however, show that Judge Greer has approved the spending down of Terri’s medical fund on Schiavo’s attorney’s fees - though it was expressly awarded to Terri for her medical care. Schiavo’s primary attorney, George Felos, has received upwards of $400,000 dollars since Schiavo hired him. This same attorney, at the expense of Terri’s medical fund, publicly likened Terri to a “houseplant” and has used Terri’s case on national television to promote his newly published book.

    MYTH: Michael Schiavo volunteered to donate the balance of the inheritance to charity.
    FACT: In October, 1998, Schiavo’s attorney proposed that, if Terri’s parents would agree to her death by starvation, Schiavo would donate his inheritance to charity. The proposal came after a court-appointed Guardian Ad Litem cited Schiavo’s conflict of interest since he stood to inherit the balance of Terri’s medical fund upon her death. This one and only offer stated “if the proposal is not fully accepted within 10 days, it shall automatically be withdrawn”. Naturally, Terri’s parents immediately rejected the offer.

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