Why raise taxes?

[Dutchcedar]

We're sure to hear the cries from the left to raise taxes in the upcoming election season. History shows it doesn't work, but that a growing economy fueled by lowered taxes does. Does anyone have a good argument for raising tax rates?

Every good liberal will tell you that low tax rates cause tax revenues to drop, hurt the economy, benefit only the wealthy and cause skyrocketing budget deficits. A Wall Street Journal article last week blew a hole in those liberal lies. The Journal reported that federal tax revenues for the first five months of fiscal year 2006 are up 10.3 percent from the same period a year ago. The 2006 revenue growth adds to a 15 percent tax revenue increase from 2004 to 2005. This good fortune for U.S. Treasury coffers is attributed to the steady and growing economy, which is largely a product of the 2003 cuts in income, dividend and capital gains tax rates.

Continued... http://www.townhall.com/opinion/colu...29/191794.html

[afalzone]

Nice troll Dutch. You play the rainmaker part really well. By that rationale, we could lower taxes to 0.0000000000000000000000001% and we would watch the take revenues grow exponentially. It's funny how some people on here purport to be conservative but really don't realize anything about finances. Our tax cuts right now aren't tax cuts. The taxes are the same. Your government is simply borrowing money to pay them for you.

Personally, I don't want to pay for you or any freeloader who thinks that running up a massive deficit is a great idea. We need to have taxes raised to balance the budget. Entitlement programs are ballooning and no matter what programs you put in place, people are still going to get old, get sick and retire. There are costs associated with that and they're not going away.

You hear people all of the time who are 'conservative' bitching about freeloaders when they themselves are what they hate. Pay your own way. I would prefer not to have to work for the next 50 years to pay for someone else's mess. Personal responsibility remember? That would include not advocating bankrupting the country and putting the tax burden onto the next generation so you can live beyond your means.

[Dutchcedar]

^^^ "The Journal reported that federal tax revenues for the first five months of fiscal year 2006 are up 10.3 percent from the same period a year ago. The 2006 revenue growth adds to a 15 percent tax revenue increase from 2004 to 2005."

Lower the rate, tax receipts go up, raise the rate, they go down. We pay more when the rates go down because we do more.

The model of your suggestion is France (or California). Please post results from either...

[tucker]

Afalzone is right about entitlement programs but social security isn’t one. I take that back SS is an entitlement program for the big spending Washington terds who rob the funds every year for pork barrel spending. Politicians are the killers of Social Security. Personal retirement funds are mismanaged and stolen by unions and employers. Hang them and we would all be better off.

Entitlement is welfare, medicade, free housing….NOLA….

If anybody is anxious to get rid of their tax return/cut pretty please send it to me…

[afalzone]

"Lower the rate, tax receipts go up, raise the rate, they go down. "

So again, by that logic lowering the tax rate to 0.00000000000000000001% would create an exponentially huge increase in tax income. If you believe that holds true then I'm truly, truly sorry for you. Did you notice my rainmaker comment and do you even know what it means? Revenues when up. Where is your direct evidence that this was caused by the increase in taxes. The United States economy is drive by a lot more factors than personal income tax rates. Why is it that somehow I doubt that you would be even writing a thread like this if either Iraq wasn't a disaster or it were the Democrats running up a debt like this.

I guess I should repeat this again since you missed it the first time. Our government did not really lower taxes. They just started borrowing more money to pay your taxes for you. It's a ruse by politicians in power to trick simpletons into giving them popularity.

This is the typical logic thrown out by freeloaders. I don't want to pay for your taxes for the next several decades. Pay for yourself. Take some responsibility for yourself and pay your own way.

[/\/\adGamer]

To help ay for all the "ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS" who get aid but dont pay taxes for onegotta make up for the extra load somewhere

[TacticalNuke]

"Lower the rate, tax receipts go up, raise the rate, they go down. "

So again, by that logic lowering the tax rate to 0.00000000000000000001% would create an exponentially huge increase in tax income.

The point is that you keep taxes reasonable, then when a recession hits you lower taxes. You're taking it to the extreme and you are, as you know, incorrect as it would not increase tax income.

Likewise raising taxes would not totally decrease tax income, because you'd be raising taxes. The point is that lowering taxes a reasonable amount during slow economic periods increase economic growth, resulting in more money for everyone, including the government.

However, since actual data and quantitative analysis destroy your argument, you can continue with your strawman (which is what your .000001% argument is) to "win" some fictitious argument.

[Soundforbjt]

To pay for the massive debts incurred by the current administration.

[jimzinsocal]

I dont the dems will ever accept the fact that the tax decrease was the right thing to do. How long has it been now? And they just wont admit the numbers.
Another incorrect broad brush is the notion that somehow Bush spends all this money by himself....and the dems are all absent when spending bills are done. And I dont buy "its a republican house/senate" arguement. If Harry Reid can kill the Patriot Act? Spending bills should be a piece of cake.
One is as guilty as the next in DC. Ive yet to see anyone of them look like theyre starving to death. Dont wanta reform Social Security? Thats fine. Wait till its someone elses problem.

[alpha_03]

Alfazone is right, with respect to where Washington is getting their monies, no offence to any body here. And that 10 or so percent you mention Dutch is adjustment for inflation, so they can maintain real world numbers- so to speak.

However, since FDR introduced this B.S "income tax", (which is actually illegal) what happend to the idea that it was only TEMPORARY? Hmmmm.

I say this, 10-percent federal flat tax accross the board, everyone pays the same based on their income- including business' , no loopholes, no BS, you pay a flat tax or you go to jail.

Tax refunds become a thing of the past.

Now, let the individual states manage their people and their monies, as it should be. But just make sure big bother is there to monitor it all.

Esp. since I am at 36% (generally speaking) - single, home owners are screwed in this country, no doubt.

[TacticalNuke]

Alfazone is right, with respect to where Washington is getting their monies, no offence to any body here. And that 10 or so percent you mention Dutch is adjustment for inflation, so they can maintain real world numbers- so to speak.

However, since FDR introduced this B.S "income tax", (which is actually illegal) what happend to the idea that it was only TEMPORARY? Hmmmm.

I say this, 10-percent federal flat tax accross the board, everyone pays the same based on their income- including business' , no loopholes, no BS, you pay a flat tax or you go to jail.

Tax refunds become a thing of the past.

Now, let the individual states manage their people and their monies, as it should be. But just make sure big bother is there to monitor it all.

Esp. since I am at 36% (generally speaking) - single, home owners are screwed in this country, no doubt.

If you do a flat tax, it should be a consumption tax, not an income tax.

That way it's very easy to track because you have to pay tax. You can hide income in offshore areas, but you can't exactly hide what you buy in the U.S.

Anyway, it'll never happen because so many people (those below the top 5-10%) benefit from the tax system now.

[Dutchcedar]

The ten percent increase in the first part of this year is not a reflection of inflation, nor is the fifteen percent increase from last year, Our inflation simply isn't running that high. The increase, like it or not, is because of an increase in our economy's power, which was emboldened by tax cuts. A 4.8% unemployment rate is as well. More new jobs created in the US than the enitre EU and Japan combined also played a big role.

I'm with ya alpha, on the abuse of taxation by the dolts in DC. And I'm in agreement with afalzone on the abuse of spending by the dolts in DC. I'm also in agreement with jimz, that its not just Republicans spending money too easily, but all the dolts in DC. Tactical Nuke's got the timing down pat, now if we could get the dolts in DC to see the simplicity of it.

afalzone, I don't mind paying higher taxes when I have the opportunity to generate more income as well. From a selfish point of view, that's all I ask... meaning even lower tax rates. Your claims that I'm somehow or another a freeloader or don't take responsibility for myself and family... well, I'm quite certain you don't believe that to be the case. If you do however, that's fine, but it certainly isn't true.

What I was trying to address here is that if you want increased tax revenues, you free up the economy by lowering rates. The proof is in the pudding. The results of doing the opposite (raising tax rates) can be seen in California and France. afalzone, if ya don't think so, put up some numbers that show otherwise or refute the numbers I put up.

[alpha_03]

Not if you police it correctly.

Excuse me Dutch, I should have said projected.

[alpha_03]

BTW Dutch, France is a mostly unionized work force are they not?

[Dutchcedar]

BTW Dutch, France is a mostly unionized work force are they not?

I'm really not sure... but am quite sure they're a largely unemployed work force...