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  1. #76
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    Go git yer 72 Virgins...
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  2. #77
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    Zahiwhatever chimes in. Although I don't see how a picture of him with some guy talking makes it his message..

    Is that his voice?


    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bba_1184217341&p=1
    Nuke em'.

  3. #78
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Nate View Post
    Zahiwhatever chimes in. Although I don't see how a picture of him with some guy talking makes it his message..

    Is that his voice?


    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bba_1184217341&p=1
    Apparently he was not happy about the Red Mosque "leader" trying to escape in high heels, burkah and purse...

    Die honorably in the fields of Jihad, and don’t live like women with moustaches and beards.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  4. #79
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    Quote Originally Posted by AMDScooter View Post
    Apparently he was not happy about the Red Mosque "leader" trying to escape in high heels, burkah and purse...
    lol, they're never gonna live that one down. I think that would be a good idea - shame is such a powerful thing in Islam; if our media would get on board and just outright make fun of jihadists, they stop showing their faces. That in turn may slow down their idealogy. (<-- new buzzword for the summer, did anyone notice?)
    Nuke em'.

  5. #80
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    I'd love to hear the boldface portions below repeated by the leaders in the west.. especially and most importantly.. Muslim leaders..

    Musharraf vows war on militants

    Musharraf vows war on militants
    President Pervez Musharraf says he is determined that extremism and terrorism will be eradicated in Pakistan.

    He was speaking in a televised address to the nation after officials said 75 bodies had been found at the radical Red Mosque in Islamabad.

    Troops launched a 36 hour attack on the mosque early on Tuesday to flush extremists out of the mosque complex.

    For months clerics and students had been defying the authorities in their campaign for Sharia law in the capital.

    Students had kidnapped police as well as Islamabad residents they considered to be engaged in un-Islamic activity.

    'Madrassa a fortress'

    Gen Musharraf praised Pakistan's security forces for freeing the Red Mosque in Islamabad "from the hands of terrorists".

    "Unfortunately we have been up against our own people... they had strayed from the right path and become susceptible to terrorism."

    "What do we want as a nation want?" President Musharraf asked. "What kind of Islam do these people represent?"

    "In the garb of Islamic teaching they have been training for terrorism... they prepared the madrassa as a fortress for war and housed other terrorists in there.

    "I will not allow any madrassa to be used for extremism."


    Gen Musharraf said those members of the military who died had given their blood for the country.

    A short while earlier, officials said the bodies of 19 people, charred beyond recognition, were among the 75 bodies found in the mosque complex, which includes a religious school for women and girls.

    An army spokesman said five of the charred bodies were of people killed by a suicide bomber in a locked room.

    There are fears women and children may be among the victims but immediate confirmation is impossible.

    Ten soldiers were killed in the operation. Officials say one suicide bomber was inside the buildings.

    'Any gender, any age'

    "We recovered the head of the suicide bomber and his body parts," said army spokesman Maj Gen Waheed Arshad.

    "We also found five bodies that were burned beyond recognition."

    He said another 13 bodies were found that were also so badly charred they could be "any gender, any age".

    Military officials said they have taken photographs, fingerprints and DNA samples from the 75 bodies they say were found at the Red Mosque, or Lal Masjid.

    Most of the bodies were buried Thursday morning in temporary graves identified with numbers.

    An Islamabad city official said at least two children were among 69 bodies buried on Thursday.

    The BBC's Barbara Plett says the girls' school, or madrassa, suffered the most damage.

    Walls are covered with bullet holes and shattered glass lies everywhere, she says.

    The cleric who led the last days of resistance in the mosque, Abdul Rashid Ghazi, was buried on Thursday in his home village of Basti Abdullah in Punjab province in front of hundreds of mourners.

    Our correspondent says many Pakistanis supported the operation, saying the government had no choice but to confront the Islamic extremists.

    But, she adds, the authorities fear a violent reaction from other radicals and the country is on high alert.

    Attacks said to be linked to the mosque assault continued on Thursday in Pakistan's volatile north-west, where support for the Taleban is strong.

    In the tribal area of North Waziristan near the Afghan border, a suicide bomber killed himself and two government officials in the town of Miran Shah, police said.

    Further north in Swat district, at least five people, three of them police, were killed in a suicide car bombing, officials said. At least one of those killed was reported to be the bomber.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  6. #81
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    CLAIM: Major Pakistani Offensive In Taliban-Held "Tribal Areas"

    From the Dawn, a Pakistani paper (I'm pretty sure) I've seen linked a lot, though I don't know if it's a highly credible source.

    The army started deploying troops in NWFP’s southern districts, adjoining the Waziristan region, amid reports that an operation to curb militancy and extremism was imminent.

    Sources told Dawn on Thursday that 12,000 troops, backed by artillery units, were moved to Tank and Dera Ismail Khan districts from Okara.

    ...

    Militants’ spokesman Abdullah Farhad accused the government of violating the peace agreement signed on September 5, 2006, under which it had to withdraw all troops.

    Sources said that soldiers reinforced their positions around Miramshah town, headquarters of the North Waziristan Agency, and started checking vehicles, looking for heavy arms.
    Adding to the credibility of the report: Musharraf Declares War on Extremists:

    President Pervez Musharraf pledged to combat Muslim extremists across Pakistan yesterday as furious crowds demonstrated against the storming of the Red Mosque and two suicide bomb attacks left six dead.

    In a televised address to the nation, Gen Musharraf said that those inside the mosque and its adjacent madrassa, or Muslim college, were "terrorists" who directly threatened Pakistan's security. They had also tarnished Islam's reputation as a tolerant and peaceful religion.

    "What do we as a nation want?" he asked. "What kind of Islam do these people represent? In the garb of Islamic teaching they have been training for terrorism. They prepared the madrassa as a fortress for war and housed other terrorists in there."

    Gen Musharraf praised the army for wresting the mosque and its madrassa "from the hands of terrorists" and said: "I will not allow any madrassa to be used for extremism."
    Regarding Waziristan, where soldiers are said to be checking for heavy weapons:

    In North Waziristan, the tribal area where both Zawahiri and bin Laden are believed to have found sanctuary, a suicide bomber walked into a government compound and blew himself up, killing three officials.
    It seems, as the kids say, to be "on."

    Thanks to Rockets Brain Trust.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  7. #82
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    Re: The other war thread

    08-06-2006, 10:23 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by otoc View Post
    Actually I have been consistent in this forum about the lack of focus and how Afghanistan was a true mission that was not completed. A search of this forum is all that it takes to disprove your Hillary tirade. Where have we moved resources to Iraq away from Afghanistan? Where is bin-ladel, the guy most wanted who would be brought in dead or alive. Why is the Afghan situation still in infrastructure mode? Why are rotations being cancelled?


    While I always appreciate an opinion I do wish you would explain your optimism that we "We will continue to take necessary steps to ensure what you and the rest of the left seem to be wishing happens does not come true."

    It was 3 generals that pointed out the current situation is not good and anarchy or civil war is where those countries teeter in spite of the "necessary steps" that have been taken during the past years.

    Btw, are you calling the generals "of the left" for pointing out the realities of our current situation?
    Failure in Afghanistan risks rise in terror, say generals(Military chiefs warn No.10 that defeat could lead to change of regime in Pakistan)

    Sunday July 15, 2007
    Britain's most senior generals have issued a blunt warning to Downing Street that the military campaign in Afghanistan is facing a catastrophic failure, a development that could lead to an Islamist government seizing power in neighbouring Pakistan.

    Amid fears that London and Washington are taking their eye off Afghanistan as they grapple with Iraq, the generals have told Number 10 that the collapse of the government in Afghanistan, headed by Hamid Karzai, would present a grave threat to the security of Britain.

    Lord Inge, the former chief of the defence staff, highlighted their fears in public last week when he warned of a 'strategic failure' in Afghanistan. The Observer understands that Inge was speaking with the direct authority of the general staff when he made an intervention in a House of Lords debate.

    'The situation in Afghanistan is much worse than many people recognise,' Inge told peers. 'We need to face up to that issue, the consequence of strategic failure in Afghanistan and what that would mean for Nato... We need to recognise that the situation - in my view, and I have recently been in Afghanistan - is much, much more serious than people want to recognise.'
    The consequences of failure in Afghanistan are far greater than in Iraq,' he said. 'If we fail in Afghanistan then Pakistan goes down. The security problems for Britain would be massively multiplied. I think you could not then stop a widening regional war that would start off in warlordism but it would become essentially a war in the end between Sunni and Shia right across the Middle East.'

    'Mao Zedong used to refer to the First and Second World Wars as the European civil wars. You can have a regional civil war. That is what you might begin to see. It will be catastrophic for Nato. The damage done to Nato in Afghanistan would be as great as the damage done to the UN in Bosnia. That could have a severe impact on the Atlantic relationship and maybe even damage the American security guarantee for Europe.'

    Ashdown said two mistakes were being made: a lack of a co-ordinated military command because of the multinational 'hearts and minds' Nato campaign and the US-led Operation Enduring Freedom offensive campaign against the Taliban. There was also insufficient civic support on, for example, providing clean water.

    Ashdown warned: 'Unless we put this right, unless we have a unitary system of command, we are going to lose. The battle for this is the battle of public opinion. The polls are slipping. Once they go on the slide it is almost impossible to win it back. You can only do it with the support of the local population.
    Adam Holloway, a Tory member of the committee who is a former Grenadier Guards officer, said: 'We are getting to the point where it will be irretrievable. That's where we are now. We are in danger of a second strategic failure [after Iraq], which we cannot afford.'
    Safer from terrorists? Yes or no.



    bb
    Last edited by baghdad bob; 07-15-2007 at 01:35 PM.

  8. #83
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  9. #84
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    ^^ Most Pakistanis are sick of the radical BS, AQ included. The move on the red mosque was widely supported. While they might not be terribly pleased with Musharraf, they surely are not going to start taking marching orders from the tools in AQ.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  10. #85
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/asiapc....ap/index.html


    "The inability of the insurgent forces to inflict any severe damage on Firebase Anaconda, while being simultaneously decimated in the process, should be a clear indication of the ineffectiveness of their fighters," said Army Capt. Vanessa R. Bowman, a coalition spokeswoman.
    A direct attack on a U.S. or NATO base by insurgents on foot is relatively rare. More often insurgents fire rockets at bases and flee. Military officials say that Taliban fighters know they can't match Western militaries in a heads-up battle, which leads the insurgents to more often rely on roadside and suicide bombs.

  11. #86
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    ^^^ Thats news? I guess for the inquiring minds that only use CNN as a source it could be...

    **EDIT** After reading that post I guess I should be more clear.. I mean it's no surprise that the terrorists have a snowballs chance in hell of winning a toe to toe fight with our military.
    Last edited by AMDScooter; 08-07-2007 at 03:16 PM.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  12. #87
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    I have no response to this

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070808...t_070808055111


    KHAR, Pakistan (AFP) - Armed men abducted and beat 11 health workers sent to a Pakistani tribal area to administer polio vaccinations to children Tuesday, forcing the suspension of the campaign, officials said. 39';
    Tribesmen in Bajaur tribal district bordering Afghanistan refused to allow the vaccinations to take place after hearing rumours that the drive was a "US plot" to sterilise Muslim children, residents said.
    "We have suspended the vaccination drive in Charming area after our vaccination team was kidnapped and beaten up by armed men there," local health director Chiragh Hussain Shah told AFP.
    The health workers were held for four hours as their captors smashed vaccination kits, Shah said.
    Last edited by jimzinsocal; 08-08-2007 at 03:47 PM.

  13. #88
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/asiapc...ive/index.html

    (CNN) -- Hundreds of U.S. and Afghan soldiers have embarked on a major operation against militants in the eastern Afghan region of Tora Bora, near the border with Pakistan, officials have told CNN.
    Spoiler!
    Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

  14. #89
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    [posted after Orang posted similar]

    HEY, WAIT: I thought all we did in Afghanistan was stage air raids and bomb civilians. And yet: " Hundreds of US-led troops have launched an offensive against al Qaida and Taliban militants in eastern Afghanistan . . . . The offensive involving ground troops and airstrikes in the Tora Bora region of eastern Nangarhar province is targeting 'hundreds of foreign fighters' who are using dug-in fighting positions, said coalition spokeswoman Capt Vanessa Bowman." Ground troops? And we're bombing "foreign fighters"? What, there were no civilians to target?

  15. #90
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    Re: Afghanistan and Pakistan

    http://foreignaffairs.house.gov/110/cor021507.htm

    The Need for More US and Allied Military Forces



    There are roughly 33,000 NATO troops in Afghanistan, plus some 12,000 remaining US troops that still operate independently as part of Operation Enduring Freedom and advisors; versus a total of 162,000 Coalition troops in Iraq. Afghanistan, however, has a population of over 31 million versus some 27 million in Iraq, its territory is 50% larger, and its transportation and communications infrastructure is far more primitive. The threat in Iraq has no major sanctuary outside the country; Al Qa’ida, Taliban, Haqqani Network (HQN), and Hezb-e Islami Gulbiddein (HiG) all have de facto sanctuaries exist in Waziristan in eastern Pakistan.



    The present level of US military forces is too weak to do the job in the areas where the US has military responsibility, and current plans to surge elements of the US 10th Mountain Division offer only a temporary solution. The US does not have economy of force, it has inadequacy of force. Competing demands in Iraq have led to a military climate where US forces plan for what they can get and not what they need.



    The US needs to adopt a success-oriented strategy, not a resource-limited strategy. The 10th Mountain division has asked for one more infantry brigade. This badly understates need even if Polish forces help the US in the east. The US needs forces strong enough to hold and build as well as win. It needs at least two, and increases in Special Forces as well. These force increases are a tiny by comparison with US forces in Iraq, but they can make all of the difference.



    The force contributions of our NATO allies present major resource problems as well. Allied countries need to provide stronger and better-equipped forces. Above all, provide forces that will joint the fight and go where they are most needed.



    The British fight well but have only 50% to 75% of the forces they need. Canada and the Netherlands are in the fight. The Danes, Estonians, and Romanians have done some fighting. The Poles are coming without adequate equipment but willing to fight. France, Spain, Turkey, Germany, and Italy are not in the fight because of political constraints and rules of engagement. Only French Special Forces have played any role and they depart in January.


    bb

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