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  1. #31
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchcedar View Post
    You could always learn to read what's written and quit trying trying to read in between the lines, even though your heroes like Charles "wannadraftyoarse" Rangle expect you to.

    I'll say it again... anyone who signs onto a hitch in the military with the expectation to go to a certain place "to fight", is a dumb-arse.

    Now if you wanna explain what's wrong with that statement, have at it.
    Not in a certain place, a place like Iraq - sure soldiers are redeployed, but troops have a right to be upset being put in the nonsense war they're currently in

  2. #32
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by tucker View Post
    This is a very thought provoking thread and a good one as well. I think this thread is a perfect example of the politics of war.

    I support the troops but I do not support what they are doing? That seems a bit peculiar I think it goes against human nature. To me it seems somewhat equivalent to saying I support Bush but I donít support any of his policies or anything he does.

    How can you not support something and yet support the perpetrators?

    I support the troops and hope they are able and allowed to accomplish their mission? I realize there will be more losses but I still support them and believe with a change in strategy they can still accomplish a suitable out come.

    Or

    I support the troops but bring them home before the mission is accomplished? Its for their own good they die as victims of an ill thought-out war.

    Having been in a similar situation I was always of the opinion those who did not support the war were not supporting me. Wrong it may be but none the less thatís what I thought.

    Donít get all hot and bothered just pointing out one aspect and Iím not at all questioning anybodies patriotism.
    Translation, support the war or you hate the troops, beautiful,, beautiful - how many of you supported Clinton's foreign policy? You can support the troops and not support the war - some of them didn't expect to be their, some dont' even condone the war, but they're doing a job they were given and that's honorable,

  3. #33
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by Computerwiz View Post
    Not in a certain place, a place like Iraq - sure soldiers are redeployed, but troops have a right to be upset being put in the nonsense war they're currently in
    That's quite a waterin' down of your previous claims.

    Yeah wiz, they have a right to be "upset".

    And so do you.

  4. #34
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by Computerwiz View Post
    Translation, support the war or you hate the troops, beautiful,, beautiful - how many of you supported Clinton's foreign policy? You can support the troops and not support the war - some of them didn't expect to be their, some dont' even condone the war, but they're doing a job they were given and that's honorable,
    Where did I say anybody hates the troops?

    All I said is you support the troops but you don’t support what they are doing. I was merely pointing out your support is conditional.

    That is called politics my friend…
    Last edited by BlackDragon24; 11-30-2006 at 06:13 PM. Reason: no need for name calling

  5. #35
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangutan View Post
    "Hate the sin, love the sinner" comes to mind, tucker.

    That's a poor analogy.

    I rather like the ridiculous one ref abortion:

    "I'm pro-choice, /but I don't believe in abortion" That's about as idiotic a load of dog squeeze as is my thread title.......there's not a trace of Aristotelian logic to it!
    -TMack

    "Forgive everyone for everything"

  6. #36
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    I think we are just getting into an argument about the definition of the word "support" here, which is kind of silly.

    Tmack, if you are convinced that there is no way you can support the troops and also be anti-war, then I guess there is no convincing you otherwise, which is fine because everyone has the right to their own opinion.

    But I would argue that they are not inter-connected....and I guess thats just my opinion.

    I think Orangutan's logic is perfectly good. I don't like the fact that our troops have been put in a situation that sucks, but I certainly won't blame them for it, and I don't feel sorry for them because after all they did sign up. I just feel like many liberals feel about the situation....lets do whatever we can as a country to make their lives easier and bring them home safe.

    And I don't really buy into the notion that somehow my attitude undermines the troops....they also signed up for the fact that what they are ordered to do may not be very popular with the folks back home.

  7. #37
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchcedar View Post
    That's quite a waterin' down of your previous claims.

    Yeah wiz, they have a right to be "upset".

    And so do you.
    I don't think I've said anything different than, they don't choose where to go, or who to fight, they put their faith in the government, therefore they can't be blamed for wars you disagree with.

  8. #38
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    My question is if this war was going much more successfully and the results thus far were much better would you still be against this war?

    Do you object to war in general or is it just this one you object to?

    Not directed at anybody in particular just curious thatís allÖ

  9. #39
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by Computerwiz View Post
    I don't think I've said anything different than, they don't choose where to go, or who to fight, they put their faith in the government, therefore they can't be blamed for wars you disagree with.
    Okey dokey, Pokey.

  10. #40
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by TMack409 View Post
    That's a poor analogy.
    Why? It fits the situation perfectly well. You can be supportive of someone while still disapproving of some of their actions. Do you "support" soldiers who rape and torture innocent civilians? Children? Your generalizations are like Swiss cheese.

    I rather like the ridiculous one ref abortion:

    "I'm pro-choice, /but I don't believe in abortion" That's about as idiotic a load of dog squeeze as is my thread title.......there's not a trace of Aristotelian logic to it!
    Do you support the death penalty but oppose abortion? (And the "believe in" portion is misleading, as it's typically put "support".) Do you support the freedom to drink alcohol but oppose drunk driving? If you want to talk logic I can do it all day long.
    Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

  11. #41
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by tucker View Post
    My question is if this war was going much more successfully and the results thus far were much better would you still be against this war?
    Yes.

    Do you object to war in general or is it just this one you object to?
    Both.
    Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

  12. #42
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    ^^^ What about the war in Afghanistan? That one has been going longer than the war in Iraq, by many standards another quagmire.

    Bring them home as well.

  13. #43
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    Quote Originally Posted by tucker View Post
    ^^^ What about the war in Afghanistan? That one has been going longer than the war in Iraq, by many standards another quagmire.

    Bring them home as well.
    I don't know by what standards you would declare Afghanistan a "quagmire" other than the length of time we have spent there. Our intentions were much clearer and less objectionable for Afghanistan, we achieved a better military victory, and it stands the chance of becoming a much stronger country now. We've seriously mishandled it, though, by turning our attention away and to Iraq rather than following through on our goals and promises. The Taliban and other extremists had their asses handed to them but they're making a comeback. The opportunity never should have existed for that to happen. Finish what you have started before embarking on another task. Quitting is certainly not the thing to do.
    Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

  14. #44
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    As far as saying pro life/pro death penalty hoakus pokus theory

    Maybe some who think along those lines feel that the innocent child's right to exist is different from the convicted killer's forfeiter of their rights to exist ? After all the convicted killer made a conscious choice to kill knowing the possible punishment while the innocent child didn't have a say at all.From short beginning to short end.

    A soldier doesn't make any choice in the matter of war other than to kill on command its not his choice who he kills or what he fights for after he enlists. I see it as either you support the war or you don't. If thousands of people were rioting in the streets or even peacefully protesting over the war the ones who say they support the troops but not the war wouldn't be sugar coating their anti-war feelings with worthless meaning slogans. I don't recall the 'I support the troops" slogans during the Vietnam conflict.During that conflict most were drafted and didnt even have the choice of enlisting or not. Maybe people now don't want to appear anti-American maybe.
    Last edited by /\/\adGamer; 11-30-2006 at 11:31 PM.

  15. #45
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    Re: "I support the troops, but not the war"

    I support our troops right to live. Bring them home and put them on border patrol. If that's not expensive enough (our leaders do love to spend our money) at least refocus them on the effort in Afghanistan. I'd like to see them make the Talibans lives a lot more miserable, better yet, wipe them off the face of the Earth.

    Here's a really crazy idea. Let's use our troops for defending Americans! We could close the bases in Japan, Korea, and Germany and use those troops to monitor shipments coming into our ports as well as southern AND northern border patrol. Iraq was, is, and always will be a mess. It doesn't matter how many lives, dollars, or years are thrown at it. We won't get what we want over there.

    It's amazing to me that after a quagmire as bad as Vietnam we've gotten ourselves into a situation that's even less resolvable, and yet there are still people defending that decision.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

    Edmund Burke

    RIP PCPER TLR
    7-14-19

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