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  1. #3931
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by Enmore View Post
    Yes and I was a conspiracy theorist I'd start thinking this was deliberate. The same thing happened to the Orbiting Carbon Observatory's launch in 2009.



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbitin...on_Observatory
    I wonder if they programmed the rocket guidance system with IPCC data for the MMGW weatherclimate model ....
    "We say in our platform that we believe that the right to coin money and issue money is a function of government....

    Those who are opposed to this proposition tell us that the issue of paper money is a function of the bank and that the government ought to go out of the banking business. I stand with Jefferson rather than with them, and tell them, as he did, that the issue of money is a function of the government and that the banks should go out of the governing business."

    William Jennings Bryan.

  2. #3932
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    ^ It would have blown up on the launch pad if those clowns had got anywhere near it.



    Here's some of the functions of a wind turbine that USE electricity:

    • Yaw mechanism (to keep the blade assembly perpendicular to the wind; also to untwist the electrical cables in the tower when necessary) -- the nacelle (turbine housing) and blades together weigh 92 tons on a GE 1.5-MW turbine

    • Blade-pitch control (to keep the rotors spinning at a regular rate)

    • Lights, controllers, communication, sensors, metering, data collection, etc.

    • Heating the blades -- this may require 10%-20% of the turbine's nominal (rated) power

    • Heating and dehumidifying the nacelle -- according to Danish manufacturer Vestas, "power consumption for heating and dehumidification of the nacelle must be expected during periods with increased humidity, low temperatures and low wind speeds"

    • Oil heater, pump, cooler, and filtering system in gearbox

    • Hydraulic brake (to lock the blades in very high wind)

    • Thyristors (to graduate the connection and disconnection between generator and grid) -- 1%-2% of the energy passing through is lost

    • magnetizing the stator -- the induction generators used in most large grid-connected turbines require a "large" amount of continuous electricity from the grid to actively power the magnetic coils around the asynchronous "cage rotor" that encloses the generator shaft; at the rated wind speeds, it helps keep the rotor speed constant, and as the wind starts blowing it helps start the rotor turning (see next item); in the rated wind speeds, the stator may use power equal to 10% of the turbine's rated capacity, in slower winds possibly much more

    • using the generator as a motor (to help the blades start to turn when the wind speed is low or, as many suspect, to maintain the illusion that the facility is producing electricity when it is not, particularly during important site tours) -- it seems possible that the grid-magnetized stator must work to help keep the 40-ton blade assembly spinning, along with the gears that increase the blade rpm some 50 times for the generator, not just at cut-in (or for show in even less wind) but at least some of the way up towards the full rated wind speed; it may also be spinning the blades and rotor shaft to prevent warping when there is no wind

    Now of course all of this has to come from the grid... powered by reliable sources of energy.

    Mmm so 'green'.


    http://www.aweo.org/windconsumption.html

  3. #3933
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Last year, Nissan were predicting that they'd sell 20,000 of their new LEAF all-electric cars in the United States in 2011. Deliveries began in the US on December 11, 2010

    Now according to their own figures, so far in 2011 they've sold 87 cars in January and only 67 cars in February (and no, I didn't miss out any zeroes).

    Well, times are hard you say?

    Yeah, it's just that sales of their other, regular vehicles were up nearly 32% in February over the same month last year.

    Regular cars don't attract large federal and state tax reduction sweeteners either.

    http://www.nissannews.com/assets/att..._Sales_rev.pdf

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governm...#United_States

  4. #3934
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by Enmore View Post
    Last year, Nissan were predicting that they'd sell 20,000 of their new LEAF all-electric cars in the United States in 2011. Deliveries began in the US on December 11, 2010

    Now according to their own figures, so far in 2011 they've sold 87 cars in January and only 67 cars in February (and no, I didn't miss out any zeroes).

    Well, times are hard you say?

    Yeah, it's just that sales of their other, regular vehicles were up nearly 32% in February over the same month last year.

    Regular cars don't attract large federal and state tax reduction sweeteners either.

    http://www.nissannews.com/assets/att..._Sales_rev.pdf

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governm...#United_States
    So far the "Leaf" has been all hype. It seems even celebrities are still waiting for them.

    During his show on Feb. 18, Letterman had dug into a gripe with Nissan and sponsorships, making fun of the Nissan Juke to his producers' chagrin while admitting he's one of the 20,000 Americans who has an electric Leaf on order that's yet to be delivered: "I'm hopeful there's going to be one at my funeral."

    http://jalopnik.com/#!5772909/how-i-...erman-on-stage

    Heh, it looks like he ended up with a Ford anyway.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

    Edmund Burke

    RIP PCPER TLR
    7-14-19

  5. #3935
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Another Global Warming fruitcake

    http://www.ted.com/talks/bill_gates.html

  6. #3936
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by falcon_view View Post
    Another Global Warming fruitcake

    http://www.ted.com/talks/bill_gates.html
    Actually, we've been discussing TWRs here a while- and I own some U, etc.

    While I know Gates is completely wrong on the CO2 equation and how to fix it, this energy technology is something I'm seeing as a viable cost replacement for our current structure.

    I've looked into TWRs and it looks promising in almost all regards. My only fear of it is the continuing dumming down of the populace with regard to CO2.

    Energy and manufacturing in America generates little CO2 and actually has been reducing steadily with technology and outsourcing. In fact, US CO2 production has flat-lined and the only thing floating it right now has been our growing number of motor vehicles.

    And there lies a huge problem developing because of the push for batteries and alternate technologies. I've looked. It's called the waste/by-products of producing them. CO2 is part of nature. Some of the waste generated here looks to be lethal.

    Another far more critical issue is the killing of our ability to be able to process CO2- most of that destruction is occurring presently in the Pac Rim. Gates would contribute far more towards saving humanity by applying his resources on that sector than wasting them by hanging with Al Gore.
    Last edited by AeroSim; 03-06-2011 at 12:13 PM.
    "We say in our platform that we believe that the right to coin money and issue money is a function of government....

    Those who are opposed to this proposition tell us that the issue of paper money is a function of the bank and that the government ought to go out of the banking business. I stand with Jefferson rather than with them, and tell them, as he did, that the issue of money is a function of the government and that the banks should go out of the governing business."

    William Jennings Bryan.

  7. #3937
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Gates is wrong about CO2 of course, but he's right about energy. We certainly need to develop a 'miracle' source of power because conventional sources are finite and wind & solar are worse than useless. Only politicians and hippies are stupid enough to believe the latter have any practical value.

    I mentioned traveling wave reactors a while back. There may also be lots of mileage in using thorium as a power source. Thorium is also far more plentiful than uranium. Fusion still requires more energy input than you get out, but that will hopefully change within the next couple of years. If they can get that right, then it'll make headlines around the world. The eco-marxist 'back to the cavers' will be livid too.

    All 3 technologies have been mentioned on this page:

    http://forums.pcper.com/showthread.php?p=4474805

    Keep an eye on the National Ignition Facility project at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory. They're working on a prototype fusion power station:

    https://lasers.llnl.gov/

  8. #3938
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    ^^^ One of my biggest gripes with this whole MMGW sham. The energy and resources wasted combating ghost farts and pursuing pie in the sky "green" energy projects that will never be fruitful... windmills FFS! All the while real environmental issues (not to be mistaken for the ones that only exist in the heavily manipulated computer models of a select few like minded individuals) go unchecked. Viable alternative energies go unused or ignored wholly. And our current suicidal "energy policy" set by the inhabitants of the asylum called DC cuts our nuts by making the massive reserves of cheap and reliable energy resources right here under our feet off limits... to protect us from a threat that has little to no basis in reality. Fuggin insanity..
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  9. #3939
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by Enmore View Post
    ....

    I mentioned traveling wave reactors a while back. There may also be lots of mileage in using thorium as a power source. Thorium is also far more plentiful than uranium. Fusion still requires more energy input than you get out, but that will hopefully change within the next couple of years. If they can get that right, then it'll make headlines around the world. The eco-marxist 'back to the cavers' will be livid too.

    All 3 technologies have been mentioned on this page:

    http://forums.pcper.com/showthread.php?p=4474805

    Keep an eye on the National Ignition Facility project at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory. They're working on a prototype fusion power station:

    https://lasers.llnl.gov/
    I remember that- and I think is was in this thread? Yes- here- with FV even:

    http://forums.pcper.com/showthread.p...ve#post4435374

    At any rate, Scooter started a thread we were getting a little involved with:

    http://forums.pcper.com/showthread.php?t=474738
    "We say in our platform that we believe that the right to coin money and issue money is a function of government....

    Those who are opposed to this proposition tell us that the issue of paper money is a function of the bank and that the government ought to go out of the banking business. I stand with Jefferson rather than with them, and tell them, as he did, that the issue of money is a function of the government and that the banks should go out of the governing business."

    William Jennings Bryan.

  10. #3940
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    26,280

    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    ^^^ I should prolly revive that thread too. What with gas heading for >$5 really fuggin soon and the bamma administration all but putting a full stop on domestic oil production.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  11. #3941
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    1,761

    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by AeroSim View Post
    Actually, we've been discussing TWRs here a while- and I own some U, etc.

    While I know Gates is completely wrong on the CO2 equation and how to fix it, this energy technology is something I'm seeing as a viable cost replacement for our current structure.

    I've looked into TWRs and it looks promising in almost all regards. My only fear of it is the continuing dumming down of the populace with regard to CO2.

    Energy and manufacturing in America generates little CO2 and actually has been reducing steadily with technology and outsourcing. In fact, US CO2 production has flat-lined and the only thing floating it right now has been our growing number of motor vehicles.

    And there lies a huge problem developing because of the push for batteries and alternate technologies. I've looked. It's called the waste/by-products of producing them. CO2 is part of nature. Some of the waste generated here looks to be lethal.

    Another far more critical issue is the killing of our ability to be able to process CO2- most of that destruction is occurring presently in the Pac Rim. Gates would contribute far more towards saving humanity by applying his resources on that sector than wasting them by hanging with Al Gore.
    I don't know enough about this subject as a whole or able to apply the science to be on either side but stand as concerned. Some time back on the History channel or something, about the tundra thawing and the amount of carbon dioxide stored in the frozen tundra is huge on any scale would be released. We know the arctic is getting warmer and can that be reversed? I don't have the science to have any idea what would happen with that much carbon dioxide released. The best I could do is plant a tree. I know a little bit about the release of carbon dioxide from the time I done a lot of fishing in lakes that had dead timber and decaying plants. The decay of timber and plants releases carbon dioxide in to the water that hamper fish to a point of kill off mainly in the winter time when water flow is low and doesn't flush out the carbon dioxide.

    For the time being I am going to be mostly an observer.
    Last edited by falcon_view; 03-06-2011 at 08:32 PM.

  12. #3942
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by falcon_view View Post
    I don't know enough about this subject as a whole or able to apply the science to be on either side but stand as concerned. Some time back on the History channel or something, about the tundra thawing and the amount of carbon dioxide stored in the frozen tundra is huge on any scale would be released. We know the arctic is getting warmer and can that be reversed? I don't have the science to have any idea what would happen with that much carbon dioxide released. The best I could do is plant a tree. I know a little bit about the release of carbon dioxide from the time I done a lot of fishing in lakes that had dead timber and decaying plants. The decay of timber and plants releases carbon dioxide in to the water that hamper fish to a point of kill off mainly in the winter time when water flow is low and doesn't flush out the carbon dioxide.

    For the time being I am going to be mostly an observer.
    It's not like the earth hasn't been thawed out before. In fact, it has spent most of it's life without ice caps and the planet teemed with life- dinosaurs. The planet was both far warmer and had much higher levels of CO2. We've also been over this before here- but it doesn't hurt to do a short review. The planet has cycled through ice caps and thawing before and ... well ... here we are.

    Here's a couple of pictures:






    As you may see- we're not even close as to what's been in history. It all started with me after doing some of the research into An Inconvenient Truth and discovering how the people been had. I found myself appalled by what was done in this movie- it was the science of market creation, not global warming.

    FV, I've honestly come to the conclusion the MMGW and the CO2 threat is part of the financial corruption that infects the world today.

    Moreover, after studying the differences between a planet without ice caps as opposed to one with an ice age - we had better hope for warming.
    Last edited by AeroSim; 03-06-2011 at 09:42 PM.
    "We say in our platform that we believe that the right to coin money and issue money is a function of government....

    Those who are opposed to this proposition tell us that the issue of paper money is a function of the bank and that the government ought to go out of the banking business. I stand with Jefferson rather than with them, and tell them, as he did, that the issue of money is a function of the government and that the banks should go out of the governing business."

    William Jennings Bryan.

  13. #3943
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    26,280

    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Welcome back to the stone age.. exactly where the eco-moonbats want us.



    Wind power blows...

    Lawrence Solomon: Don’t count on constant electricity under renewable energy, says UK electricity CEO


    Electricity consumers in the UK will need to get used to flicking the switch and finding the power unavailable, according to Steve Holliday, CEO of National Grid, the country’s grid operator. Because of a six-fold increase in wind generation, which won’t be available when the wind doesn’t blow, “The grid is going to be a very different system in 2020, 2030,” he told BBC’s Radio 4. “We keep thinking that we want it to be there and provide power when we need it. It’s going to be much smarter than that.

    “We are going to change our own behaviour and consume it when it is available and available cheaply.”

    Holliday has for several years been predicting that blackouts could become a feature of power systems that replace reliable coal plants with wind turbines in order to meet greenhouse gas targets. Wind-based power systems are necessary to meet the government’s targets, he has explained, but they will require lifestyle changes.

    Under the so-called “smart grid” that the UK is developing, the government-regulated utility will be able to decide when and where power should be delivered, to ensure that it meets the highest social purpose. Governments may, for example, decide that the needs of key industries take precedence over others, or that the needs of industry trump that of residential consumers. Governments would also be able to price power prohibitively if it is used for non-essential purposes.

    Smart grids are being developed by utilities worldwide to allow the government to control electricity use in the home, down to the individual appliance. Smart grids would monitor the consumption of each appliance and be capable of turning them off if the power is needed elsewhere.

    Holliday’s startling comments on BBC Radio 4 were reported by The Daily Telegraph.

    Lawrence Solomon is executive director of Energy Probe and the author of The Deniers. LawrenceSolomon@nextcity.com
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  14. #3944
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    Putting food in the gas tank... and subsidizing farmers to do it. Whodathunk that was a bad idea??

    The reverse of UN’s disastrous “oil for food” program: Ethanol uses 40% of US Corn Crop

    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  15. #3945
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    Re: The Great Global Warming Thread (merged)

    The exchanges render all the "changed nothing" rhetoric in regard to the climategate emails moot. Read the whole story at the second link if ya have a few minutes... extremely "enlightening".

    Wahl Transcript Excerpt

    From Capitol Hill come excerpted notes from the interview transcript between the NOAA Inspector General and Eugene Wahl. I am advised that it’s not a continuous chain, with some back and forth between the paragraphs excluded. I am advised that the excluded sections, often lengthy, do not place the excerpts in any different light than reading them as presented below.

    Neither the Muir Russell nor Oxburgh “inquiries” took transcripts despite requests from the UK Parliamentary COmmittee to do so.

    Q. Did you ever receive a request by either Michael Mann or any others to delete any emails?
    A. I did receive that email. That’s the last one on your list here. I did receive that.
    Q. So, how did you actually come about receiving that? Did you actually just — he just forward the — Michael Mann — and it was Michael Mann I guess?
    A. Yes
    Q. — That you received the email from?
    A. Correct …
    A. To my knowledge, I just received a forward from him.
    Q. And what were the actions that you took?
    A. Well, to the best of my recollection, I did delete the emails.
    Q. So, did you find the request unusual, that they were — that the request — that you were being requested to delete such emails?
    A. Well, I had never received one like it. In that sense, it was unusual.
    Q. I guess if the exchange of comments and your review was appropriate, I guess what I’m just trying to understand why you’d be ask to delete the emails after the fact, at the time that they’re — it appears that the CRU is receiving FOIA requests
    A. Yeah. I had no knowledge of anything like that. But that’s what they were — where they were coming from. And so, you’d have to ask Keith Briffa that. I don’t know what was in his mind.
    To Serve Mann

    By Steven Mosher
    and charles the moderator

    Sources confirm that a federal inspector has questioned Eugene Wahl and Wahl has confirmed that Mann asked him to delete emails. Wahl has also informed the inspector that he did delete emails as the result of this request.

    There are times during the course of Climategate when you feel like you are in a twilight zone episode, especially the kind where the ambiguous meaning of terms plays a critical role, like “To Serve Man”.



    That episode is apt because of the central role trust plays and because of the role puzzle solvers play in uncovering that the do-gooder aliens cannot be trusted. “Serving”, of course, has now taken on new meanings, as in “you got served” or pwned. With the release of the news that Mann successfully instructed Wahl to delete emails, it’s clear that Mann got served or pwned by Wahl; but more importantly, he got served or assisted by Dr. Pell, Dr. Scaroni, Dr Brune, and Dr. Foley. Who are they? They are the Penn State team who served Dr. Mann by purporting to exonerate him in the Penn State inquiry, despite Mann’s own non-responsive response to a key question being on its face evasive, and begging followup questions. Regardless, Mann’s non-answer did not even purport to support their conclusion about his actions. In short, they covered for him.

    The puzzle begins back in 2006. Keith Briffa the author of chapter 6 in the 4th Assessment Report of the IPCC (AR4) is struggling under the directive of review editor Johnathan Overpeck, who has encouraged him to come up with something “more compelling than the Hockey Stick”, that iconic symbol of Global warming created by Michael Mann in the third assessment report.

    Briffa is struggling with the comments and suggestions of a particular reviewer who we now know was Steve McIntyre, the citizen scientist who has been dogging Mann for several years. In what appears to be violation of IPCC rules Briffa writes to Eugene Wahl asking for assistance in answering McIntyre’s comments. More important than this communication being apparently at odds with IPCC directives, is that Briffa is asking Wahl to comment on McIntyre’s work, a process that is clearly supposed to take place in peer reviewed literature. Wahl and McIntyre had both been critical of each other’s work and such disputes are most fairly handled by independent third parties and not by the disputants themselves.

    In mid 2006 the following exchange occurs between Briffa and Eugene Wahl:

    MORE. . .
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


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