Economic News/Discussion

[SteveW]

WASHINGTON – The economy is moving in reverse faster than the government can measure.

The contraction for the fourth quarter of 2008 had been estimated at 3.8 percent just a month ago. Then the Commerce Department raised it to an astonishing 6.2 percent Friday — the largest revision since the government started keeping records in 1976.

That was the economy's worst showing in a quarter-century and raised the prospect that the nation could suffer its worst year since 1946.

"Consumers are just hunkering down and saying 'game over,' and businesses in response are cutting back on investment and employment," said Brian Bethune, economist at IHS Global Insight. "It's a negative feedback loop."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090228/..._ec_fi/economy


NEW YORK (Reuters) – Berkshire Hathaway Inc, Warren Buffett's insurance and investment company, barely broke even in the fourth quarter because of losses on derivatives contracts tied to the stock market, which caused its net worth to tumble $10.9 billion.

Buffett also offered a gloomy outlook for the economy, saying in his annual letter to Berkshire shareholders: "The economy will be in shambles throughout 2009 -- and for that matter, probably well beyond."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090228/...hire_buffett_1

This also speaks volumes on the Great Messiah's grand plan. He's thrown a Trillion dollars at it resusitation dead financial instutitions and archaic industrial giants - results thus far, nada.

Wall Street is not responding favorably. So, that too is GWB's doing right?

This is not just a US recession - it's a GLOBAL recession.

[AMDScooter]

This also speaks volumes on the Great Messiah's grand plan. He's thrown a Trillion dollars at it resusitation dead financial instutitions and archaic industrial giants - results thus far, nada.

Wall Street is not responding favorably. So, that too is GWB's doing right?

This is not just a US recession - it's a GLOBAL recession.

Don't fret Steve.. we all knew when the messiah's cure all (more gubberment... more taxes see: The "new" New Deal) was greeted with the predictable "F*CK YOU" from the markets they would go into full blown "it's GWB's fault" mode.

The messiah's followers not only have extremely short memories about how we got here to begin with:



The seem to also forget GWB is not longer el presidente and the markets are responding to their messiah & congress... not GW. It'd be fun to watch this cluster f*ck that is the current CNC & the Congressional nitwits were they not putting my kids into debit they will never pay off in their life times.

[Dutchcedar]

^^^ As long as the responsibility for this, in large part at least, isn't hung on the GSE's of Freddie and Fannie, along with our leaders' insistence that crap loans be written and underwritten and backed by government money, this problem simply can't be solved by the perpetrators... and won't be.

So far the solutions are eerily similar to California's economic solutions... go into debt and solve it by going deeper into debt. Keep your new indebtedness at a pace that outruns your tax receipts and all will be well.

And of course, the great solution... sell the minions on the idea that raising tax rates on the other guy actually increases tax receipts. It doesn't, but oh well.

Big Sweden, here we come.

[AMDScooter]

^^^ As long as the responsibility for this, in large part at least, isn't hung on the GSE's of Freddie and Fannie, along with our leaders' insistence that crap loans be written and underwritten and backed by government money, this problem simply can't be solved by the perpetrators... and won't be.

So far the solutions are eerily similar to California's economic solutions... go into debt and solve it by going deeper into debt. Keep your new indebtedness at a pace that outruns your tax receipts and all will be well.

And of course, the great solution... sell the minions on the idea that raising tax rates on the other guy actually increases tax receipts. It doesn't, but oh well.

Big Sweden, here we come.

[AMDScooter]

EXPLODING DEBT LOAD FOR BUNCH OF FREELOADERS

WASHINGTON - Emblazoned on every page of President Obama's budget are the words: "A New Era of Responsibility."

That would be a responsibility for you to fork over more taxes.

That would be a responsibility for your company to pay even higher taxes.

That would be a responsibility for you to foot the bill for one of the largest expansions of government welfare in history.

Obama's budget schemes to drain staggering amounts of money from people who worked for it and steer it to people who didn't.

This isn't the free market. It's the freeloader market.

Spoiler!

"It is not just misguided but dangerous to raise taxes on small businesses and families that can't afford to pay them," said Rep. Eric Cantor (R-Va.).

According to the IRS, the top 20 percent of wage earners already pay 85 percent of the taxes in this country. Under Obama's new redistribution alchemy, the percentage they shoulder invariably will rise.

And the ranks of people reliant upon this fattened government will surely go up, too.

In addition to spending billions more on government welfare programs, Obama takes one of the few widely acclaimed programs in the federal government and turns it into a ticking time bomb.

Buried deep in the spending plan, Obama proposes spending even more on the Pell Grant program, which pays tuition costs for select students.

Most alarming, Obama wants to turn it into an entitlement. In other words, he proposes to dramatically increase its size and make it a permanent and untouchable part of annual federal spending with further built-in yearly increases.

At a time when entitlement programs, such as Social Security and Medicare, are on the verge of catastrophic collapse and literally threaten the continuance of the federal government, Obama proposes just piling on more.

How does he hope to pay for all of this?

He plans to recoup $200 billion of new spending by "closing the tax gap," a perennial vow made by politicians with your tax dollars in their eyes.

This gap between what people theoretically owe and what they pay never has been closed because it would cost so much more than it would reap to try going after every baby sitter or lawn worker who has pocketed some extra income.

It's just a gimmick.

And after years of railing against Republicans over reckless deficit spending, Obama is settling on three consecutive years of trillion-dollar deficits.

This year alone, deficit spending will be $1.8 trillion.

But even among Democrats, there remain some deficit hawks who will choke, and that will lead to only one solution: even bigger tax hikes than the president already has proposed.

This may be the "change" Obama was dreaming about, but it won't be what people were hoping for.

1st Remark:

Henrietta Freehouse wrote:
"Freeloader"? What's that about? I was oppressed, I deserve every dime of y'alls money President 0bama takes from you.

[falcon_view]

This crap has been going on for ever and you boys and I do mean boy because you are boys point fingers back and forth not solving a thing, zip, zero. You are playing against the house no matter who is the house and the deck is stack. Those speech's and hearing are for your amusement and your amusement only. You better get your own house (GOP) in order because nothing will pass unless some republicans go along. There will always be some republicans to go along to get it done while those like you set around and point fingers. This is the greatest game in America not baseball and those on capital hill know it. So suck it up and get some Ky jelly because you are going to need it.

[jimzinsocal]

I meant to post this the other day after seeing/reading the hysterical media
asserting all sorts of stats about the Dow Average/Measure.
Like "worst February since 1933" or whatever nonsense.
Sure. Correct from a blinded perspective.

But lets take a look at how the "Dow" has changed over time.

http://www.dogsofthedow.com/djdelete.htm


My point? If the Dow gave Citi and Bank of America the "boot"?
Maybe we wouldnt be curling up in the closet in a fetal position sucking
our thumbs.

Here. And Im not questioning the Dow Method.
But I take it with a grain...like alot of measures.

http://money.cnn.com/data/dow30/

[Frank1946]

LOL! Imagine what the Dow would look like if "Nash Kelvinator (Nash Motors)" was still listed.

[SteveW]

.....There will always be some republicans to go along to get it done while those like you set around and point fingers. This is the greatest game in America not baseball and those on capital hill know it. So suck it up and get some Ky jelly because you are going to need it.

KY jelly is a good idea. Maybe if enough were injected in the "Big O" he could pull his head out of his a$$.

Tell ya what. Explain the market's lack of response to the "Great Stimulus Plan".

BONUS POINTS: Then explain how the "Cap-and-trade carbon emissions plan" is going to help the US if we don't apply the same restricions to ALL imports to the US? Explain how it's not going to have a devastating effect on the US industrial base and not negatively impact our competetive postition in global trade.

[old82]

it's simple. the chinese will take all our jobs and make stuff for us that's toxic, destroys china's environment, and is easy to throw away due to poor design/construction.


yes, without work we'll be able to feed off the printing presses and buy cheap good from china's slave class.

[Dutchcedar]

^^^ Speaking of printing presses... there should be quite a few very large ones on E-Bay and Craig's list this year.

[old82]

why?

[falcon_view]

Tell ya what. Explain the market's lack of response to the "Great Stimulus Plan".

The money hasn't been sent out yet and projects have not started. People have cut way back on spending or better words wasteful spending.

BONUS POINTS: Then explain how the "Cap-and-trade carbon emissions plan" is going to help the US if we don't apply the same restricions to ALL imports to the US? Explain how it's not going to have a devastating effect on the US industrial base and not negatively impact our competetive postition in global trade.

Cap-and-trade, this will push companies to go green to create jobs. Will going green stop global warning?? I don't have a clue if it will or not but the what it will do is create new jobs just like the computer age or any other age you could name. Do we all "need" computers? No, so by a large part it is a waste. Government is going to waste money and the fight is going to be who get to waste it and on what. The only way you will get away from waste is to get away from money.

My question to you is what do you want to waste money on to create jobs?? It has to be done to move the economy. You get in that frame of mind and don't take it too far like they did with sub-prime loans and time will be good. Your job is to make it possible to put people to work and get us out of this nose dive. Take a look at your life compared to someone in a third world country and how much you waste. Waste makes our world go around. When you decide on what you are going to waste money on are you willing to take the heat for it?? I am sure you could take the heat just like those on capital hill.

[SteveW]

^^^^ Thanks for dropping the name calling and staying on topic.

We have some common ground and some points of disagreement.

That's good. I'll come back to this tomorrow my brother - time for a cigar on the patio and milk bones for the doggies.

Rest well.

[old82]

The money hasn't been sent out yet and projects have not started. People have cut way back on spending or better words wasteful spending.




Cap-and-trade, this will push companies to go green to create jobs. Will going green stop global warning?? I don't have a clue if it will or not but the what it will do is create new jobs just like the computer age or any other age you could name. Do we all "need" computers? No, so by a large part it is a waste. Government is going to waste money and the fight is going to be who get to waste it and on what. The only way you will get away from waste is to get away from money.

My question to you is what do you want to waste money on to create jobs?? It has to be done to move the economy. You get in that frame of mind and don't take it too far like they did with sub-prime loans and time will be good. Your job is to make it possible to put people to work and get us out of this nose dive. Take a look at your life compared to someone in a third world country and how much you waste. Waste makes our world go around. When you decide on what you are going to waste money on are you willing to take the heat for it?? I am sure you could take the heat just like those on capital hill.

one way to achieve this would be to stop outsourcing. if it's alright for china to require things be made in china, why not us?