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  1. #1
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    War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    In the world of the PC, you'd have to be both blind and deaf to miss last week's riveting drama that became known instantly as the "NVIDIA and Intel Battle". In nearly back to back swings, both Intel and NVIDIA executives landed metaphorical punches to the gut of one another in attempt to show analysts, stock holders and, we assume they still matter, PC users, why their companies are going to be the technology leaders for the future computing. There were days of bickering between NVIDIA and Intel and though we'll hold our opinions on the particulars of this battle for another day, there was one surprising omission from the debate:

    AMD.

    Yes the company is having financial difficulties that many have used as bait for a potential takeover or buy out, but I am going to spend this time to discuss why I think both Intel and NVIDIA are overlooking a still-competitive opponent which could turn out to be a drastic mistake.

    Read more here: http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=547
    Ryan Shrout
    Owner, PC Perspective
    rshrout -at- pcper -dot- com
    --= Follow me on Twitter =--


  2. #2
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    1,084

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    That was a very well-written article with good points, Ryan.
    Sometimes I feel like I'm becoming a dinosaur.

  3. #3
    Joined
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    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Ryan, thank you so much for the well thought out and informative article. Thanks even more so for remaining unbiased throughout your reviews/articles.
    I always try to do so myself, but normaly end up offending both parties more than if I had actualy taken a side. *sigh*
    Personaly (though personaly I find myself pessimistic) I don't think AMD/ATI's chances of surviving the next few years are too good. I hope they do, but don't spend too much time on it.

    Also, lately I find myself supporting AMD/ATI, while still remaining unbiased in my opinions, I want them to make some sort of breakthrough and grab hold of some more market share.

    I remain unbiased, yet supportive of one side with thoughts like this:
    "IF AMD DIES WE (consumers) ALL LOOSE!! EVEN IF IT IS ONLY MARGINAL, COMPETITION IS STILL COMPETITION, BUT WITHOUT AMD IN THE PICTURE INTEL AND (for the time being) NVIDIA WILL HAVE FREE REIGN OVER THE MARKET!!! What that means is that they will be free to set their own prices from that time forward, AND they no longer have any incentive to develop newer, better, products."

    When companies fight, it is left to the consumer to reap the benefits.

  4. #4
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    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    I owned both ATI and nVidia stock long ago when nvidia went public.

    Sold nvidia long ago and wish I hadn't.

    Since the merger went through, I know own AMD stock.

    It is in my best interest that AMD does well and it's killing me that they don't have exactly what I want yet and I need a replacment for my Athlon 64 754 socket system.

    As nice as Intel's offerings are, I can't buy Intel because I'm shooting myself in the foot and couldn't complain about my earnings.

    I'm holding out for either a good ATX sized 780G/SB700 (Not micro-atx) or when they finally decide to pop out some ATX 790FX/SB700 boards.

    I wish they would hurry up!!!

    -Mario
    Last edited by m3rdpwr; 04-17-2008 at 10:57 PM.

  5. #5
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    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Update:

    Well, looks like they just announced a full size ATX 780G/SB700 sometime between my last post and this morning.

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131289

    ASUS M3A-H/HDMI AM2+/AM2 AMD 780G ATX AMD Motherboard

    I'll have to try and dig up more info as Newegg has none except a single pic!

    -Mario

  6. #6
    Joined
    Aug 2004
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    10,611

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Not bad. Looks like you will need to pull that ASUS logo out of the NB coooler and stick in a fan!!


    "The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them."
    - Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

  7. #7
    Joined
    Apr 2008
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    4

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    After some searching I realized a couple things.

    No Firewire although not a huge deal breaker.

    Also, no extra USB cables appear to come with it so that's an added expense that puts this motherboard on the pricey side.

    Also it is possible that newegg is simply charging too much.
    I noticed that about them in recent times...

    Another thought, the MSI K9A2 Platinum seems like a good choice seeing it comes with a lot for the money.
    Would be nice to have an updated version with the SB700.
    I like the added benefit of better cooling.

    I wish manufaturers would hustle!

    -Mario
    Last edited by m3rdpwr; 04-18-2008 at 10:23 AM.

  8. #8
    Joined
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    1

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan View Post
    In the world of the PC, you'd have to be both blind and deaf to miss last week's riveting drama that became known instantly as the "NVIDIA and Intel Battle". In nearly back to back swings, both Intel and NVIDIA executives landed metaphorical punches to the gut of one another in attempt to show analysts, stock holders and, we assume they still matter, PC users, why their companies are going to be the technology leaders for the future computing. There were days of bickering between NVIDIA and Intel and though we'll hold our opinions on the particulars of this battle for another day, there was one surprising omission from the debate:

    AMD.

    Yes the company is having financial difficulties that many have used as bait for a potential takeover or buy out, but I am going to spend this time to discuss why I think both Intel and NVIDIA are overlooking a still-competitive opponent which could turn out to be a drastic mistake.

    Read more here: http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=547
    Very interesting article, found it on digg.com. Infact i found it so interesting i had to register and voice my opinion.

    Let me start by saying that i agree with you 100% and i belive AMD is far from out the company has been around for a very long time and if it wasnt for its recent success with the athalon they would still be in the underground making competitive processors without getting intel too mad. Which seems is what they have done. With alot of public scrutiny and alot of mistakes (mistakes that they used to make in the past as well just no one noticed) they have the image that they are in really bad shape, but i disagree, i think what you wrote makes perfect sense.

    The only thing that i think you failed to mention is that NVIDIA seems to be going in a new direction teaming up with VIA on the processor front to create cheap and competitive CPU/GPU combo's that outperform intel descreete graphics. We will see what unfolds but im a firm believer that despite their stock price and ongoing public embarrassments AMD is poised for a hard comeback.

  9. #9
    Joined
    Apr 2008
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    2

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    I thought AMD took the lead recently with their HD3870 X2 graphics cards? In the article he says NVidia has the lead but that's not what I've seen in product reviews. Or did NVidia recently release something new?

  10. #10
    Joined
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Also not to post three thousand times, but I also thought AMD recently took the lead in the integrated graphics department as well with it's 780G Northbridge? It was co-engineered with ATI and from what I've heard it's the fastest IGP on the market, even though it only allows poor performance from the modern DirectX 10 games.

    At least it will run them, though. But mostly it's being touted as a chipset for media PC's or users concerned with High Definition playback and etcetera on their PC.

  11. #11
    Joined
    Aug 2004
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    10,611

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Drubie, you can use the edit function to add stuff you forgot to write, I do it all the time.

    the 9850 x2 is a one slot crossfire solution, and it's lead is arguable, not definitive. SLI a couple of GTX's and the discussion is over.

    Your point about the 780G is made in the article.


    "The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them."
    - Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

  12. #12
    Joined
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    64

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Quote Originally Posted by Drubie87 View Post
    Also not to post three thousand times, but I also thought AMD recently took the lead in the integrated graphics department as well with it's 780G Northbridge? It was co-engineered with ATI and from what I've heard it's the fastest IGP on the market, even though it only allows poor performance from the modern DirectX 10 games.

    At least it will run them, though. But mostly it's being touted as a chipset for media PC's or users concerned with High Definition playback and etcetera on their PC.
    Though I would say the ati3800x2 is a good videocard, the nv9800x2 beats it in all areas, even the 8800ultra beats it in some areas.

    There's an new post on anandtech benchmarking the ati780G vs nv8200. It seems the nvidia solution beats it in just about all tests. For both power efficiency and fps, but not by much.

    99% of the people and maybe 80% of gamers, who buy computers will be fine with a computer spec'ed with phenom 9500/3870 and intel/nvidia equivalent, and they will feel and perform pretty much the same. It's when you move up beyond that to the top maybe 1% that AMD has no competition. What AMD/ATI has is "different" and hopefully that "different" will someday become "better" resulting in the competition trying to do the same and then it will be, for a while, "best".

    Right now, AMD/ATI has great products, they just don't have the best products, and some people want the best, no matter if they need it or not. That's what makes us enthusiasts right?

    AMD I'm rooting for you, behind my Intel/Nvidia bits.
    Last edited by hl3395; 04-22-2008 at 01:38 AM.


    What do I use my 1.5TB of space for? Well it isn't really 1.5TB it's more like 1.3TB, and that's much less space than 1.5TB.

  13. #13
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    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    Quote Originally Posted by lucegunz View Post
    Very interesting article, found it on digg.com. Infact i found it so interesting i had to register and voice my opinion.

    Let me start by saying that i agree with you 100% and i belive AMD is far from out the company has been around for a very long time and if it wasnt for its recent success with the athalon they would still be in the underground making competitive processors without getting intel too mad. Which seems is what they have done. With alot of public scrutiny and alot of mistakes (mistakes that they used to make in the past as well just no one noticed) they have the image that they are in really bad shape, but i disagree, i think what you wrote makes perfect sense.

    The only thing that i think you failed to mention is that NVIDIA seems to be going in a new direction teaming up with VIA on the processor front to create cheap and competitive CPU/GPU combo's that outperform intel descreete graphics. We will see what unfolds but im a firm believer that despite their stock price and ongoing public embarrassments AMD is poised for a hard comeback.
    Thanks for the comments and welcome to the forums! As for the NVIDIA issue - that is something I also agree with but am saving my NVIDIA and Intel discussion for a separate piece.
    Ryan Shrout
    Owner, PC Perspective
    rshrout -at- pcper -dot- com
    --= Follow me on Twitter =--


  14. #14
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    Location
    Bogota, NJ
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    7,028

    Re: War for Visual Computing: Why AMD Could Have the Best Chance

    I think the real question is: Can AMD Survive till Fusion?

    It was just reported that AMD is pushing 45nm till Q4. That is bad news from a money perspective and that will be noted on wall street.

    The X4 and X3 series are very nice but Intel is cheaper, faster & cooler.

    I was very impressed with my X4 9850, its a sweet chip but it doesn't OC past 2.6. So not every 9850 made is an OC monster.

    Intel has just slased prices on a bunch of 65nm parts and the 45nm parts are starting to become widely available.

    Can AMD survive?
    "Angels on the sideline, Puzzled and amused.
    Why did Father give these humans free will?
    Now they’re all confused."


    940@ 3.0, Biostar 750(Bios 7/23) Geil 2 x 2GB (DDR2-1066), OCZ 600, Xigmatek HDT-S1283, WD AAKS 640 X2 Raid0, EVGA 560, Auzentech X-Studio, ASUS Xonar DX, Win 7

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