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Thread: More bad news

  1. #1
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    More bad news

    But a sign of the times

    GM to close 4 truck plants

  2. #2
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    Re: More bad news

    Yeah...It's because everyone's going "green"....

  3. #3
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    Re: More bad news

    Yup. Cant have things both ways. Cant institute all sorts of mpg changes etc and not have the obvious downside.

  4. #4
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    Re: More bad news

    It's really, really sad. The US is becoming more of a third world country while countries like China and India are becoming more of what the US once was. I foresee myself 30 years in the future telling my grandchildren about the cars with big, wonderful V8's with actual torque and power that I used to drive, all the while peering out a window facing a street filled with bicycles and mopeds.

    It does amaze me though that even a horribly managed company like GM didn't have anything at all in their huge fleet of vehicles as a backup in case the price of oil was to suddenly go up. I mean, it's not like they've never been through the exact same thing before or anything back in the late 70's/early 80's.

  5. #5
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    Re: More bad news

    Quote Originally Posted by kbohip View Post
    It's really, really sad. The US is becoming more of a third world country while countries like China and India are becoming more of what the US once was. I foresee myself 30 years in the future telling my grandchildren about the cars with big, wonderful V8's with actual torque and power that I used to drive, all the while peering out a window facing a street filled with bicycles and mopeds.

    It does amaze me though that even a horribly managed company like GM didn't have anything at all in their huge fleet of vehicles as a backup in case the price of oil was to suddenly go up. I mean, it's not like they've never been through the exact same thing before or anything back in the late 70's/early 80's.
    I hear you. This is probably as fast as they can react to a gas spike.
    Im sure they have to look at a million trends before they make a decision of this magnitude.....gas remaining high for a duration...falloff in unit sales for each product etc.....no prospect for improvement...

    But yeah. Plant closings are painful. This one even has implications for Mexico and Canada.

  6. #6
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    Re: More bad news

    Quote Originally Posted by Afterburner View Post
    Yeah...It's because everyone's going "green"....
    It has less to do with going 'green' and more to do with the over-reliance on trucks and SUVs by the domestic manufacturers as primary sources of revenues, as well as a failure to adapt to changing consumers' needs in the face of escalating gasoline prices.

    Auto sales plunge in face of $4 gas [With gas at record highs, buyers stay away from SUV and pickup models, hitting May sales at GM, Ford and Toyota]

    Don't blame the treehuggers, blame GM management.

    A true patriot is a lover of his country who rebukes and does not excuse its sins.
    - Frederick Douglas

    May we never confuse honest dissent with disloyal subversion. - President Dwight D. Eisenhower

  7. #7
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    Re: More bad news

    You reap what you sow.
    Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

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  9. #9
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    Re: More bad news

    This one hits home pretty close. My town(St Thomas, Ontario) has a 1 million sq ft. plant(Formet) that employs 1 600 worker. The plant makes the truck frames for the GM Oshawa plant. So in my town the total ppl. that will/have lost their jobs just this year is now 2 400. And St Thomas is only about 36 000. So sad to see.

  10. #10
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    Re: More bad news

    this sucks

    this is all because of the UAW and idiots buying jap crap cars

    with no GM here, this country will go down the shithole, unless you like paying $50 for a loaf of bread

    "same here, it'll be a sad day should amdmb ever totally dissapear, i don't care too much for these "pc's" or their "perspectives" i just like my amdmb's." - SuBX3r0

  11. #11
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    Re: More bad news

    Quote Originally Posted by scruff35 View Post
    This one hits home pretty close. My town(St Thomas, Ontario) has a 1 million sq ft. plant(Formet) that employs 1 600 worker. The plant makes the truck frames for the GM Oshawa plant. So in my town the total ppl. that will/have lost their jobs just this year is now 2 400. And St Thomas is only about 36 000. So sad to see.
    Similar situation around here. Janesville's plant, as I recall, is the oldest or next-to-oldest plant in GM's stable. It's in a city of ~60,000 just a few miles up the highway. I've got plenty of friends/neighbors employed there. As you can well imagine, the direct layoffs at GM are just the tip of the iceberg. You've got dozens of local direct suppliers to the plants that are gonna take a big (potentially fatal) hit, and hundreds of other businesses that the GM employees go to spend money. It hurts top to bottom.

    I've lived it myself. The next city south of Janesville is home, and I worked at the bedrock company of the city. After more than 150 years of operation and with more than 8500 people employed worldwide, it died due to an interesting combination of global economy, bad management, unrealistic labor requirements, etc. There was a little blame for everyone, with the bulk falling on a bloated management group that made a few really bad decisions.

    In a city of ~35,000 with outlying population over 100K, we dropped over 2000 direct jobs with thousands more lost at our suppliers and other local businesses. The city and region have survived, though many of the engineers moved to find jobs. I count myself lucky to have found good work that didn't require moving.

    The effects are still visible, but on the whole we're doing OK. With the Janesville plant going down, though, it's going to be tough sledding for a while again.

  12. #12
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    Re: More bad news

    Quote Originally Posted by PrivatePixel View Post
    It has less to do with going 'green' and more to do with the over-reliance on trucks and SUVs by the domestic manufacturers as primary sources of revenues, as well as a failure to adapt to changing consumers' needs in the face of escalating gasoline prices.

    Auto sales plunge in face of $4 gas [With gas at record highs, buyers stay away from SUV and pickup models, hitting May sales at GM, Ford and Toyota]

    Don't blame the treehuggers, blame GM management.
    Partially true. While they seem to a little behind in their reaction to the inflating gas prices, they were filling the demand for those types of vehicles. Give the consumer what they want. Now the market is shifting and they have to be hasty in their reactions. Yes, the large vehicle sales are down, but the demand for the new Malibu and G6 have made it possible for a 3rd shift at the plants building those. It sucks whenever plants close. However, there are American workers, right here in Michigan, going back to work because of that 3rd shift. They are shifting their strategy, but it's not fast enough. Plus, this hasn't only hit GM. It's hitting every part of transportation. I'm in flight school and aviation gasoline is at $5.60/gal and they expect $7.00/gal before end of summer....

  13. #13
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    Re: More bad news

    As for GM reacting, there's too much corporate inertia. Even in the face of $2-$3 / gallon gas the models were still moving. They've been toying with assorted takes on the electric car since at least the mid-70s, but there has never been sufficient economic data in hand to make the leap. In hindsight, sure, all can see. Now they're up against the development time of 2+ years to bring a new model to market and the billions of dollars involved for retooling.

    Anyway, three to five years ago no shareholders would have supported the investment necessary to have a full stable of small and hybrid vehicles available today. When you're reliant upon Joe Q Public for approval, it's virtually impossible to be anything but reactionary.

  14. #14
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    Re: More bad news

    It's not a matter of them not having stockholder approval for mass-producing hybrid and small cars. Rather, it's a matter of the "Big Three" making uncompetitive vehicles all around, save SUVs and trucks. Their cars are only now starting to achieve par with their Japanese rivals. There's no reason they couldn't have been making good, small and midsize cars in moderate volumes for the past decade and a half, like the Japanese have been doing.
    Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

  15. #15
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    Re: More bad news

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangutan View Post
    Rather, it's a matter of the "Big Three" making uncompetitive vehicles all around, save SUVs and trucks. Their cars are only now starting to achieve par with their Japanese rivals. There's no reason they couldn't have been making good, small and midsize cars in moderate volumes for the past decade and a half, like the Japanese have been doing.
    Agreed. GM banked heavily on SUV and truck production, in spite of slowly rising gasoline prices, because they yielded a larger profit margin than small and midsize cars. The recent announcement of the plants' closings within the next three years should come as no surprise to anyone affiliated with the organization because upper management either failed to heed and/or deliberately ignored the warning signals of the past three years: i) the gradual decline of body-on-frame pickup trucks and SUV sales during this period (from 45% in 2005 to roughly half of that this year), and ii) escalating gasoline prices have greatly diminished the value of the HUMMER brand (which should have been unloaded a lot sooner, though finding a list of suitors would prove to be a challenge even a few years back). Now CEO Wagoner is trying to convince the public that the Volt is the greener, spiritual successor to the Cobalt, a vehicle that ranked 17th out of 20 among compact sedans in a recent Consumer Reports survey. Even if the technologies behind the Volt is proven in real-world tests, the biggest hurdle that GM faces is consumer perception of their cars, something that is difficult to reclaim after years of subpar offerings.

    A true patriot is a lover of his country who rebukes and does not excuse its sins.
    - Frederick Douglas

    May we never confuse honest dissent with disloyal subversion. - President Dwight D. Eisenhower

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