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  1. #16
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Quote Originally Posted by Parn View Post
    Just read the Mandriva part. You seem to have more critics on it than Kubuntu yet you gave it a higher score than Kubuntu. Am I missing something here?

    Really? I found it hard to actually think of things about Mandriva that I disliked, and I thought the list was shorter. Given a straight choice Mandriva would edge it for me. But mainly I feel it is simply easier for a newbie to use - the point of the articles.

    Interesting too about the DVDs: because I certainly couldn't see a live install version. That said, I've deleted the distro from my HDD so I can't see the name - I'll try to check tomorrow.


    M

  2. #17
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    I've gone back and remarked both of them. But Mandriva still wins so far, because docked a further point off off both of them. It struck me that Mandriva is good, but it's not very good - the business with the proprietary drivers would be very annoying to a beginner (it was pretty annoying to me), and as I said in my note, it's entirely down to politics. But principally I think that giving Mandriva 9/10 made the headroom too low - it could only be beaten by perfection.

    M

  3. #18
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    bump...

    Meridian has the Fedora review up now - and a great job too

    What's interesting for me is that you didn't have too much trouble getting what I may perceive as the more difficult things, like wireless/WPA and wireless printing working.

    The graphical updater in RH/Fedora has always sucked for as long as I can remember and is as slow as hell. Part of the problem may be eliminated from updating from the command line ('yum update'), but I think it also relates to a memory shortage issue. Fedora has a relatively high turnover of updates being a bleeding edge distro, and as you found out, if you install it once it's been out a while, you get offered hundreds of updates in one hit. I think trying to resolve dependencies and install so many at one time can slow most systems to a crawl if they don't have huge amounts of memory - you're almost reinstalling/updating the whole system! Anyway, if installing shortly after release when there are far fewer updates, things appear to go more smoothly (and quickly), and it's then easy to stay on top of updates as and when they are released.

    Anyway, I was interested to read how you got on as Fedora 9 is due for release in a little under a month, and RHEL 6 shortly after that from the F9 stable base.

  4. #19
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Again nice work.

    I use KDE in my Fedora install and like Meridian has pointed out, it takes me quite sometime to polish the UI. Also in order to get rid of the non-working Gnome programs from the KDE install, the user will need to un-select those packages during the initial installation.

    Fedora always has a very high turnover of updates even right after its release date.

    I always configure my Samba share through smb.conf, so can't comment on this SWAT thing. By the way I use static IP in Fedora and don't have an issue.

    Marmo:
    Ci5 4690K + Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD5H + 2x8GB Corsair 1600 C9 + Palit GTX980 SJ + 256GB(SSD)/1TB(HDD) running Win7 Pro x64.

    Kanon (wife's PC):
    Ci5 6600K + Gigabyte GA-Z270X-Gaming 5 + 2x8GB Corsair 2666 C16 + MSI GTX1080 G+X 11Gbps + 256GB(SSD)/1TB(HDD) running Win8.1 Pro x64.

    Alania:
    Dell Vostro 3460: Ci7 3632QM + HM77 + 6GB DDR3-1600 + Nvidia GT630M + 480GB SSD running Win7 Pro x64.

    Moss (Windows Hyper-V RemoteFX server):
    Ci5 6600K + Asus Maximum VIII HERO + 2x8GB Corsair 2666 C16 + MSI GTX660 TF + 2x2TB (RAID1) HDDs running Win2012 R2 Std. x64.

    Flame (Linux server / F@H):
    PIIX4 925 + ASRock 890FX Deluxe5 + 2x4GB Corsair 1833 C9 + Sapphire HD5750 1GB + 2x250GB(System RAID1)/3x500GB(3ware 9650SE-4LPML RAID5) HDDs running CentOS 6.7 x64.

    Valis:
    C2Q Q9650 + Asus P5Q3 Dlx. + 2x4GB Corsair 1600 C8 + EVGA GTX560 Ti SC + 2x74GB/500GB HDDs running Fedora 21 x64.



  5. #20
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    The problem isn't just Gnome programs being visible in KDE, but the fact that if you add any more KDE packages than the default ones then the KDE menu is heaving with programs. Many of these are same ones in two, or even three, different places. There are three different menu lists which are for changing system settings for instance, with slightly different names ans slightly different lists. It's a mess. But it's only KDE which is affected: Gnome has a few KDE apps, but not many. KDE is also lacking a tool for browsing network computers, whereas Gnome has one as part of the default setup. It's clear that KDE support is more a case of: "Yea, that'll do", rather than the fully polished Gnome. At some point I may try an install from scratch of just KDE to see how it is then.

    I appreciate what you say about editing smb.conf, but I'm interested in how much can be done without having to. And I've yet to find a distro which lets you change the workgroup name (so you can join a Windows workgroup) without an crafty edit.

    As for needing RAM, the lappy has 2GB - clearly not enough!

    Didn't I read somewhere that CentOS is basically Fedora with proven packages?

    A google tells me that Fedora 8 has an issue with static IP addresses: you tell it that you are using one, and what it is, and Fedora then ignores you and uses DHCP anyway! That's my experience anyway. But I figure the majority of newbies would use DHCP anyway.


    M

  6. #21
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Well the DHCP range of my LAN is from 20 - 50 and my Fedora box is set to 52. I can access the samba share on my fedora from windows box using that IP address, so this proves that static IP works.

    CentOS is a clone of RHEL, not Fedora.

    Marmo:
    Ci5 4690K + Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD5H + 2x8GB Corsair 1600 C9 + Palit GTX980 SJ + 256GB(SSD)/1TB(HDD) running Win7 Pro x64.

    Kanon (wife's PC):
    Ci5 6600K + Gigabyte GA-Z270X-Gaming 5 + 2x8GB Corsair 2666 C16 + MSI GTX1080 G+X 11Gbps + 256GB(SSD)/1TB(HDD) running Win8.1 Pro x64.

    Alania:
    Dell Vostro 3460: Ci7 3632QM + HM77 + 6GB DDR3-1600 + Nvidia GT630M + 480GB SSD running Win7 Pro x64.

    Moss (Windows Hyper-V RemoteFX server):
    Ci5 6600K + Asus Maximum VIII HERO + 2x8GB Corsair 2666 C16 + MSI GTX660 TF + 2x2TB (RAID1) HDDs running Win2012 R2 Std. x64.

    Flame (Linux server / F@H):
    PIIX4 925 + ASRock 890FX Deluxe5 + 2x4GB Corsair 1833 C9 + Sapphire HD5750 1GB + 2x250GB(System RAID1)/3x500GB(3ware 9650SE-4LPML RAID5) HDDs running CentOS 6.7 x64.

    Valis:
    C2Q Q9650 + Asus P5Q3 Dlx. + 2x4GB Corsair 1600 C8 + EVGA GTX560 Ti SC + 2x74GB/500GB HDDs running Fedora 21 x64.



  7. #22
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Quote Originally Posted by Meridian View Post
    As for needing RAM, the lappy has 2GB - clearly not enough!

    Didn't I read somewhere that CentOS is basically Fedora with proven packages?
    LOL, shouldn't be a memory issue then

    Yes, CentOS is a binary rebuild of Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL), RH's premium paid Enterprise product, using the freely available source RPMs. RH take the base of every 3rd Fedora release for their Enterprise line, so:

    RHEL 3 == The old RH Linux 9
    RHEL 4 == FC3
    RHEL 5 == FC6
    RHEL 6 == F9

    in terms of the closest match for comparison. It's not a direct comparison as RHEL 5 uses the stable releases from FC6, so the RHEL release will always be more stable/tested than the corresponding Fedora release.

    CentOS mirrors the upstream RH version numbering, so for example CentOS 5 = RHEL 5 minus RH support. An Enterprise release is all about stability and long term support (7 years as standard), and the base packages (versions) will never change throughout the lifespan of the product. For example, RHEL3 is still supported and is still using the same 2.4 series kernel that it originally shipped with, albeit with all security patches and many new hardware drivers back-ported into it. This continuity is essential to enterprise who may be developing custom mission critical applications and don't want some latest and greatest package update breaking their applications every couple of months (think the Chicago Mercantile Exchange, who do a trillion dollars of trade on Linux).

    So long as you don't want/need bleeding edge hardware support or features, it's great for home users too - rock solid stable, you don't get 100 updates a week, and you don't get caught in the constant 6 month upgrade cycle. If it's good enough for a stock exchange doing a trillion dollars of trade, it's probably good enough for me

  8. #23
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    Re: Linux distros for beginners

    +1 for Sticky!
    Interested to see any revisions to this thread now that ubuntu hardy (8.04) is out, and Mandriva one 2008 Spring is out also.
    Intel E6750 C2D
    400x8 (3.2GHz) 32C idle/58C Load @ stock 1.31V/HSF | Gigabyte DS3R Rev 1 bios F13 | OCZ XTC Rev 2 @4-4-4-15 | Antec Sonata 3 500W | Palit 8800GT driver v.169.21 | WD 500GB | 22" 226BW | Logitech x-540 5.1

    AMD64 (754) 3000+ @2GHz |
    | ASUS K8N-E DLX BIOS 1.11 | 512x 2 OCZ Premier DDR400 2.5-3-3-7 | Antec Sonata 380W | 9600 Pro 128MB | 19" 930B

  9. #24
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    Re: Linux distros for beginners

    This thread is linked in the main FAQ sticky. And as the first post says, yes, I'll try to keep up-to-date with new versions of distros I've already looked at.


    M

  10. #25
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Moderator's note, I moved the above two posts from the actual review just to keep things nice and tidy.

    SP

  11. #26
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    OK, now I need some suggestions on which distros to try now. Bear in mind that each of these reviews takes a few hours, so I can't do dozens and dozens of them. I'm also trying to stay with fairly high-profile distros aimed at least partly at people wanting to try Linux for the first time. So far I've done what could loosely be called the "Big Four":

    Fedora
    Mandriva
    OpenSuse
    (K)ubuntu

    I've started working on PCLinuxOS, which also makes a thing of being a "try-it-and-see" distro. So what next? My feeling about Gentoo and Debian is that they are a little hard-core for my remit - although at some point I'll probably try Debian just for myself. There are a lot of specialist distros which seem to address single issues, such as the various ones trying to get Myth TV to work. I've got a copy of CentOS, but it seems a bit "corporate" for me - even more than Suse. That's just am impression BTW - I've not actually tried installing it yet. I've had a look around DistroWatch to see what is generating the interest, but not really come to any conclusions.

    First thought is Mint, which seems to have a reasonable following. But this leads to a thought: Mint is just a modified version of Ubuntu, so is it worth it? But then as afar as I can see, most distros are based on modifying other distros. Of course (K)ubuntu is based on Debian anyway, so I guess I've already broken that idea.

    So, what which further distros would you like to see me write up? Remember that they need to be "main-stream", aimed at least partly at beginners, and fairly simple.


    M

  12. #27
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    I agree with your reasoning, and think PCLinuxOS and Mint would be good choices.

    Like you say, gentoo is too hard core, CentOS is not that dissimilar from Fedora except a few versions behind. I'd be interested in what you think of debian though, being one of the "purer" distro's.

  13. #28
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Quote Originally Posted by Spankin Partier View Post
    Moderator's note, I moved the above two posts from the actual review just to keep things nice and tidy.

    SP
    Thanks. I realized afterwards that this thread existed.

    Meridian, you might want to link each review back to this thread (so users can make comments).

    You might want to start reviewing the lesser known distros, ones that are recommended for very old pc's - like DSL, SimplyMEPIS-CD_7.0-rel_32 (i couldn't get it working in vmware)...

    This past week, I finally installed linux on an actual computer. 1.6ghz, 256mb. Sluggish when hdd's are accessed, but otherwise it is quite fast. I only notice minor lags because once you go C2D or quad, you can't go back to machines older than 2 yrs
    Intel E6750 C2D
    400x8 (3.2GHz) 32C idle/58C Load @ stock 1.31V/HSF | Gigabyte DS3R Rev 1 bios F13 | OCZ XTC Rev 2 @4-4-4-15 | Antec Sonata 3 500W | Palit 8800GT driver v.169.21 | WD 500GB | 22" 226BW | Logitech x-540 5.1

    AMD64 (754) 3000+ @2GHz |
    | ASUS K8N-E DLX BIOS 1.11 | 512x 2 OCZ Premier DDR400 2.5-3-3-7 | Antec Sonata 380W | 9600 Pro 128MB | 19" 930B

  14. #29
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    No problem Chrispy. I noticed afterwards that there wasn't a link to this thread from there, so I'm not surprised you missed this one.

    DSL would be an interesting distro to try. Its radically different from the others. Its goal is not to be fancy and polished. Its designed to be small and fast. No bloated software like ooo and many of the other 'standard' packages that you see in most distros today.

  15. #30
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    Re: Good Job Meridian!

    Interesting, but probably a little specialised - remember the market I'm aiming at. I may try it myself sometime, with the idea of booting it off my laptop SD card.


    PCLinuxOS tunred out to be a bust, as the shipped kernel (6-18.8.x) doesn't support much of my hardware, including both network devices. Without network access I can't easily update the kernel (I need 6-22.x). So that review has been abandoned, but what there is is posted. It's a shame because otherwise it seemed a fair distro. I'm currently about half-way through Mint.


    M

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