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  1. #181
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    Twain Harte, CA
    Posts
    20,453

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^ And since you're a carbon based life form, Enmore, you owe me!!!

    Its all gotten so ridiculous.

    I wish people would get on with doing something constructive rather than fangering out ways to pluck other people's pockets.

  2. #182
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,279

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^ Yup.. the CCE (Chicago Climate Exchange) is a massive fail so CA steps in with their own.

    Chicago Climate Exchange = FAIL, Now California opens “Pacific Carbon Exchange”

    UPDATE: related story shows what can happen when emissions trading doesn’t have proper checks and balances – Carbon trading tempts firms to make greenhouse gas

    California hasn’t learned from the failure of the Chicago Climate Exchange this year, when a ton of Carbon traded for a mere 5 cents. Nobody wanted to buy it even at that ridiculously low price. But, like a zombie, carbon trading rises again in brain dead broken California.


    final day on CCX - click to enlarge

    Now the the AB32 madness begins, and PCarbX (which sounds like some over the counter antacid remedy) is the new trading scheme. I give it two years, max. Here’s the story from the San Francisco Chronicle.

    California poised to enter carbon-trading market

    Andrew S. Ross



    Today could be seen as the biggest day yet for California’s climate change law, assuming, as expected, the state Air Resources Board signs off on the rules to implement it.

    It will also be a big day for Aaron Singer, CEO of San Francisco startup Pacific Carbon Exchange, (at left) which is engaging in an enterprise thought dead in the water not so long ago: carbon trading.

    “It’s the official starting gun for California and for Western regional carbon markets,” Singer said. “It means we get to make this business a growing reality.”

    Central to the law, which goes into effect in 2012, is a “cap and trade” system designed to limit the amount of carbon from the state’s 500 largest emitters – mostly power plants, energy companies and heavy industry.

    Companies emitting less than their state-mandated limit can trade their unused allowance – also known as carbon credits, or offsets – with companies that may be seeking to emit more than their mandated share.


    “This is a significant milestone,” said Josh Margolis, CEO of Cantor CO2e, a San Francisco offshoot of New York’s Cantor Fitzgerald, referring to the board’s expected action. “In the trading world, it’s been a decadelong anticipation.”

    With the Bay Area Council serving as the firm’s incubator, Singer has been working on its trading infrastructure for the past two years and is in the process of obtaining the certifications and accreditations from the U.S. Commodity and Futures Exchange Commission.

    In the meantime, PCarbX, as it is known, plans to begin some futures and options trading next year, pending a full rollout when the bell officially rings in January 2012.

    In September, it also signed a memorandum of understanding with the Shanghai Environment and Energy Exchange to explore the establishment of more carbon markets in the United States and China.

    Other entrants: PCarbX is not alone. In addition to Cantor CO2e, others in the “environmental commodity” business who are reported to be coming to California include the global Intercontinental Exchange and the Green Exchange, both with U.S. headquarters in New York. “We expect healthy competition,” Singer said.

    “As a San Francisco-based entity with ties to policymakers, they’re in a unique position,” said Adam Raphaely, director of environmental markets at Karbone, an environmental commodity brokerage and project finance company in New York. “We see a potential relationship there.”

    Neither is California alone, even though Congress and the Obama administration gave up on a national cap-and-trade policy this year.

    The Western Climate Initiative, a cap-and-trade program, which includes several Western states and Canadian provinces, is due to go into effect – also in 2012.

    Still, for all the anticipation, carbon trading here is likely to start small, especially as the Air Resources Board is initially giving emission allowances away for free, rather than the $10 minimum per ton the agency had proposed in its rules. And companies don’t necessarily have to trade through exchanges.

    “You won’t see a big bang, but, rather, a buildup in intensity,” said Margolis, who has estimated the market could be worth anywhere from $3 billion to $58 billion by 2020 – the target year for California’s emissions to be lowered.

    “This is much more than simply a business opportunity,” Singer said. “We’re here to serve the aims of AB32 and help the next generation of clean tech investment for our state.”

    Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...#ixzz18L4gAqtW
    Other than perpetuating the MMGW scam what else do these two states have in common? Oh ya.. the worst state budget deficits in the country. Go figure...


    &

    Senate Dem to propose two-year block on climate-change regs

    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  3. #183
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,279

    Re: Let's talk California



    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  4. #184
    Joined
    Nov 2001
    Location
    E n g l a n d
    Posts
    10,978

    Re: Let's talk California



    Joe Vranich, Business Relocation Coach, Irvine California


  5. #185
    Joined
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Kern River Valley, CA
    Age
    71
    Posts
    21,594

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^


    California is a fine example of a progressive socialist paradise.

    Beware coming attractions for your state and Obambi Land…

  6. #186
    Joined
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Crazy AZ USA
    Posts
    3,516

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^

    Of course, Arizona learned from the best- but the US in general can kiss their a$$ because most of our key industries didn't bother to look at another state- but China, India, Malaysia. Half of my company went nowhere but overseas and they aren't hiring new Americans.

    But we are getting this for bartering Big Macs and insurance policies-

    http://www.azcentral.com/news/electi...s-current.html

    The school nurse is becoming an endangered species.

    State parks have closed, or are limping along thanks to local donations.

    And nearly 100 Arizonans lost medical transplant coverage.

    Those are some of the consequences of the state's struggle to erase its budget deficits thus far. And the cuts are about to become much more drastic. When lawmakers return to the Capitol in January, they face a $2.25 billion deficit over the next 18 months.
    ...

    GOP Gov. Jan Brewer and the Republican majority in the Legislature have ruled out tax increases, and other options for balancing the budget are nearly tapped out. That means deep cuts are inevitable.

    They haven't released specifics yet, but Brewer and legislative leaders have indicated they will have to target education and health care - the two biggest pieces of the budget.

    ....

    The budget cuts so far have fallen heavily on education, social services and medical programs.

    ....

    The cuts to date have affected everything from classrooms to child care, tax collection to environmental regulation.

    State funding for all-day kindergarten is gone, ending the program in many districts.

    ....

    People classified as seriously mentally ill lost many of their state-supplied services, from housing assistance to case management.

    The state curtailed payments to families raising children in poverty, reduced child-care subsidies and froze a children's health-care program.

    The state Departments of Environmental Quality and Water Resources no longer receive support from the general fund, which means higher fees for those who need permits.

    Last week, the State Land Department won a six-month reprieve from a court order that would have forced them to lay off 100 employees. The Legislature must find a way to fund the department as of July 1, 2011, or the agency will take an 88 percent staff cut.
    That's just what they want you to know, but what is really the state's responsibility? So where's the relief?
    Taxpayers also have paid a higher price.

    Voters in May increased the state sales tax by 1 cent per dollar for three years. That hike, an 18 percent jump to 6.6 cents, was done to buffer health care, education and public safety from deeper cuts.

    Property-tax rates also went up when Brewer vetoed a bill to permanently eliminate the education equalization tax, boosting collections by $250 million. The tax had been on hold for three years.
    Tough for lawmakers

    The challenge for the new Legislature will be how to meet the constitutional requirement for a balanced budget while navigating an obstacle course that ranges from the political to the personal, the technical to the legal.
    And then there are the moral hazard problems. The people in AZ continually vote in overrides for schools and whatnot- but the administrators continue to cut spending, grow classrooms, freeze wages, but still manage to get their own raises and bonuses. Sound familiar?

    Adams and his Senate counterpart, President-elect Russell Pearce, say the mismatch between tax collections and spending makes it imperative to cut into the state's biggest-spending programs: education, health care and public safety.

    Exempt those three areas from cuts, Adams explains, and what's left is about $820 million for the rest of state government. That means everything from the driver's-license bureaus and the courts to the Legislature and the Governor's Office could be cut, and there still wouldn't be enough savings.

    But their task is more complicated than a simple math problem of subtracting services until spending matches the money in state coffers.

    For example, nearly two-thirds of the budget is off-limits because of voter and federal mandates, although some legislators have signaled that they might defy those limits.

    For the current budget year, "maintenance of effort" requirements from the federal stimulus program block lawmakers from cutting the K-12 and university budgets. Those requirements are gone for fiscal 2012, but voter-imposed mandates remain.

    The new federal health-care-reform bill locks the state into maintaining its current level of coverage under the AHCCCS program. That's a $1 billion burden that Brewer and many GOP lawmakers say the state can't support. However, they risk $7 billion in Medicaid dollars if they cut service levels.

    The one-time maneuvers they've used in past years are depleted, although a few budget gimmicks likely remain.

    And then there are the political considerations.

    Education, the largest slice of the state budget, got a strong vote of confidence from voters in May, when they voted to tax themselves more to support schools. To turn around and cut the education budget will be tricky.

    "The good choice vs. the bad choice doesn't exist anymore," said Rep. Vic Williams, R-Tucson, who serves on the Appropriations Committee. "They're all poor choices."

    But, he added, lawmakers believe the public has their backs. Like Tobin, he pointed to last month's election results in which Republicans widened their majorities in the Legislature.

    "You saw more Republicans voted into office predicated on our willingness to deal with the budget deficit," he said.
    In reality, education is over-bloated with top-heavy mis-managers who simply need to be fired. This whole thing reeks of perpetually penalizing the people and those who do the work to pay off the status quo ... anyhow.
    Last edited by AeroSim; 12-27-2010 at 12:02 PM.
    "We say in our platform that we believe that the right to coin money and issue money is a function of government....

    Those who are opposed to this proposition tell us that the issue of paper money is a function of the bank and that the government ought to go out of the banking business. I stand with Jefferson rather than with them, and tell them, as he did, that the issue of money is a function of the government and that the banks should go out of the governing business."

    William Jennings Bryan.

  7. #187
    Joined
    Sep 2003
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    Kern River Valley, CA
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    71
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    21,594

    Re: Let's talk California

    Quote Originally Posted by AeroSim View Post
    ^^^

    In reality, education is over-bloated with top-heavy mis-managers who simply need to be fired. This whole thing reeks of perpetually penalizing the people and those who do the work to pay off the status quo ... anyhow.

    Exactly…

    At least Arizona is doing something even if it’s the wrong approach. In California they think the problems will all magically go away if they ignore them. Their only answers are more spending and a federal bailout.

    I hope the rest of the country is in a charitable mood because the handouts are just beginning. California, New York, New Jersey and more ???


  8. #188
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    Twain Harte, CA
    Posts
    20,453

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^ It doesn't help matters that California's education system is educating foreigners en masse on the dime of citizens.

  9. #189
    Joined
    Sep 2003
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    Kern River Valley, CA
    Age
    71
    Posts
    21,594

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^
    Are you trying to wreck my day or somethin’…

    Don’t get me started on California’s illegal masses.

  10. #190
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,279

    Re: Let's talk California

    If the rest of the country looks to CA (that alone should have the country running like hell from the liberal agenda)... we here in CA should be looking at what happened to the oober libberal bastion of Detroit. Even the overseas press knows a notable disaster when they see it.

    Detroit in ruins
    Yves Marchand and Romain Meffre's extraordinary photographs documenting the dramatic decline of a major American city


    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  11. #191
    Joined
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Corruptfornia
    Posts
    3,785

    Re: Let's talk California

    I don't feel so good today. Brown in, Harris in, etc. Where's the
    Pepto. I feel as if Californians have sold themselves down the
    river so to speak, electing all these people who don't know what
    a savings account looks like. I guess you know I didn't vote for
    any of these, but I and a lot of others are stuck with em. For instance
    Took me over $450.00 to smog and reg my old 92 truck for just this year.

    I could of really used that money..



    I don't think there's much chance of that now..^

  12. #192
    Joined
    Aug 2003
    Location
    West Richland, WA
    Posts
    6,397

    Re: Let's talk California

    Quote Originally Posted by AMDScooter View Post
    If the rest of the country looks to CA (that alone should have the country running like hell from the liberal agenda)... we here in CA should be looking at what happened to the oober libberal bastion of Detroit. Even the overseas press knows a notable disaster when they see it.

    Detroit in ruins
    Yves Marchand and Romain Meffre's extraordinary photographs documenting the dramatic decline of a major American city


    wow, looks like a post-apocalyptic movie set. Hard to believe that is one of nation's biggest cities.
    Brian

  13. #193
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,279

    Re: Let's talk California

    Good read here...

    Raging Against “Them”

    It’s All Greek to Us

    In very un-Icelandic fashion, last week protestors in Athens tried to blow up a downtown courthouse. Over a year after the Hellenic meltdown, the Greek newspapers still reflect the popular fury—protests, strikes, senseless violence—at the mandatory cutbacks, the public sector layoffs, and the high-interest needed to attract investors to shaky Greek bonds. And yet amid the furor, 60% of the public still polls in favor of the European Union. How are we to diagnose the drowning non-swimmer who eagerly grasps—and yet hates—the life preserver?

    A bit of story-telling: When I lived in Greece in the 1970s, it was a relatively poor country. The road system was deplorable; the airport at Athens was little more than an insulated warehouse. I usually stayed in hotels with bathrooms down the hall. A bus trip of about 200 miles translated into about a six hour marathon. The buses were often of eastern European make and spewed black smoke into the Athenian air whose toxic bite could devour marble. Rail travel was nightmarish (biking was quicker). There was no bridge across the Gulf of Corinth. The Athens “subway” was little more than a 19th century electric carriage.

    Greeks’ second homes were one bedroom village affairs. It was rare to see a Mercedes in Athens. I knew one Greek who had a swimming pool. Getting off an island ferry boat usually meant meeting a swarm of older ladies trying to hawk you their extra bedroom for rent.

    You get the picture:1970s Greece reflected a small southern Balkan population wedded to a siesta lifestyle, on a rocky peninsula in which there was little wealth other than tourism, a poorly developed agriculture, some shipping, and remittances from Greek expatriates in the United States and Germany.

    Fast forward to the post-Olympics Greece: five star hotels, 20,000 plus private swimming pools (most of them unreported for tax purposes), half the work force ensconced in cushy government or government-related jobs, Attica dotted with Riviera-like second homes, BMWs more common than Mercedeses, billions of euros worth of new highways, and a new airport and subway system.

    In other words, somehow a country without a manufacturing base and with poor productivity, a small population, an inefficient statist economy, and bloated public sector suddenly went from near third world status to a standard of living not that much different from a Munich or Amsterdam. How? Did Greek socialism produce all that wealth?

    Well, we know the answer: northern European cash—borrowed, given, or swindled. The radical new affluence in part was justified by the fact that Germans and Scandinavians wanted good infrastructure and facilities when they went on their annual summer Greek vacations—along with pan-EU pipe dreams and fraudulent Greek book keeping that disguised massive debt.

    Now? Oz is over with and the Greeks are furious at “them.” Furious in the sense that everyone must be blamed except themselves. So they protest and demonstrate that they do not wish to stop borrowing money to sustain a lifestyle that they have not earned—but do not wish to cut ties either with their EU beneficiaries and go it alone as in the 1970s. So they rage against reality.

    California Got What It Wanted

    The same is true of California. Our elites liked the idea of stopping new gas and oil extraction, shutting down the nuclear power industry, freezing state east-west freeways, strangling the mining and timber industries, cutting off water to agriculture in the Central Valley, diverting revenues from fixing roads and bridges to redistributive entitlements, and praising the new multicultural state that would welcome in half the nation’s 11-15 million illegal aliens. Better yet, the red-state-minded “they” (the nasty upper one-percent who stole from the rest of us due to their grasping but superfluous businesses) began to leave at the rate of 3,000 a week, ensuring the state a Senator Barbara Boxer into her nineties.

    Yes, we are proud that we have changed the attitude, lifestyle, and demography of the state, made it “green,”and have the highest paid public employees and the most generous welfare system—and do not have to soil our hands with nasty things like farming, oil production, or nuclear power. And now we are broke. Our infrastructure is crumbling and an embarrassment. My environs is known as “Zimbabwe” or “Appalachia” for its new third-world look that followed from about the highest unemployment and lowest per capita income in the nation. Again, thanks to the deep South, our schools are not quite last in reading and math. So of course, like the Greeks, we are mad at somebody other than ourselves. Californians are desperate for a “them” fix. But who is them? “Them” either left, is leaving, or has been shut down.

    Consumers are furious at spiking gas and food prices, and the collapse of state revenues. The illegal alien cadre is furious that there are cutbacks in their entitlements. The Latino community says that it cannot support anyone who wants to close the border and opposes amnesty. The public employees are furious in Greek-like fashion at the thought of cuts to pensions and lay-offs. The professors and UC administrators are either suing the state or turning on each other. Where are a few hundred Bill Gates and Warren Buffetts who would gladly pay more in taxes for the rest of us from their ill-gotten gains?


    The Statist Religion

    What strikes me is not that leftism does not work, but that when it is indulged and doesn’t work, its beneficiaries scream at the unfairness of it all—in the fashion that a theorist who claimed 2 plus 2 equals 5 blames the construct of mathematics because his equation is not true. Why don’t Germans just give Greeks the hundreds of billions of euros that they “owe” them?

    The green lobby got all it wanted—subsidies, insider dealers, fame, money, influence. And then came Climategate, the multimillionaire Al Gore’s personal and professional meltdown, the coldest, iciest, and snowiest winters in memory, all the false warnings about record hurricanes and tsunamis becoming the new norm, the Orwellian metamorphosizing nomenclature (global warming begat climate change that is now begetting “climate chaos”).

    Gorism is becoming a permanent fixture of late night comedians. When the New York Times keeps publishing op-eds about how record cold proves record global warming, the world wonders: what would record heat prove?

    But whom to blame? The bad earth that is not boiling this winter? Right-wing zealots who cannot comprehend that very cold proves very hot. Red-state yahoos that don’t understand the brilliance of cap and trade? Broke governments that did not subsidize enough green power, green farming, and green energy?

    The New Liberal Age

    By January 2009, I was reading brilliant new books promising an end to conservatism, a new 50-year-old liberal ascendancy, the final triumph of John Maynard Keynes, and of course the apotheosis of the omnipresent “god” Barack Obama. By May 2009 we were lectured that the nascent tea party was an Astroturf fake movement, then a racist dangerous movement with Nazi undertones, and then a splinter nihilist know-nothing movement without political consequences.

    By November 2010, all the above vanished in a blink. Furor followed from the Left that Obama was not a Great Stone Face savior, that the tea party was all too real, that the conservatives were back, and that liberalism had suffered its worst electoral defeat since 1938. How can all this be? Whom to blame?

    Inconvenient Truths

    Yet why not carry on with the progressive agenda? Would not the Greeks be happier if the Germans said, “Sorry, we won’t loan you anything at any interest rate, so please by all means riot all you wish”?

    Would Californians be happier if we let in, say, 10 million more illegal aliens, and shut down east-side San Joaquin Valley water deliveries as well to save far more fishlets than just the smelt? Are not we still discriminating against transsexual and transgendered in the military? Why is there not diversity/affirmative action redress for underrepresented gay officers? Why are not these legitimate questions?

    Cannot liberals press on with their dream and insist on amnesty, go for single-payer health care, lobby for a 50% income tax rate on higher incomes? If spring is delayed by frost and snow this year into June or July, would that even more so prove the case for global warming? Will Al Gore make another film, A Really Really Inconvenient Truth?

    In short, there is no “them” who wrecked Greece, ruined California, subverted the climate change movement, sidetracked a half century of liberalism to come, or discredited mega-deficit spending.

    “Them” you see is simply a shorthand for “I got what I wanted, and I am mad at someone or something for not allowing the world to become what I think it should have been.”
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  14. #194
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,279

    Re: Let's talk California

    Gubbenor moonbeam skips town... even SF Gate noticed..

    Jerry Brown skips biggest budget problem: pensions

    It was no surprise to see Gov. Jerry Brown take bold and immediate steps to try to derail the state's runaway budget, but the biggest obstacle blocking the tracks remains.

    CalPERS, the California Public Employees' Retirement System, is still the 600-pound gorilla in the room.

    At a Monday morning news conference, the state's new governor laid out his plans to cut $12 billion in spending and raise $12 billion in revenue to present a balanced $84.6 billion budget in June.

    Days after announcing the elimination of the office of the secretary of education, which operated at a cost of nearly $2 million last year, Brown said the only department spared reductions would be the state's primary education system, which covers kindergarten through high school.

    Social service programs would suffer deep cuts under the governor's budget offer along with $500 million each from the state's two public university systems. And while Brown proposed a little more than $300 million in wage reductions to nearly 57,000 state workers, everyone knows that the title fight lies ahead.

    The 10 percent wage cut to union workers who had not settled on a bargaining agreement is but a drop in the bucket compared with the cost of providing retirement benefits to 1.6 million workers in 3,000 public agencies and school districts across the state.

    In the case of the state retirement system's top earners, including many police and fire departments, employee contributions to retirement plans have been minimal. Until last year, Oakland police officers made no contributions to their own retirement plan. And neither did the Oakland City Council.

    Brown made only the slightest reference to the issue on Monday when he mentioned that pension reform was coming.

    Whatever he presents must come in the form of a detailed plan that shaves from the high end of the system, because three-fourths of CalPERS retirees earned less than $36,000 in retirement benefits in 2010, according to information on the organization's website. Brown is treating pension reform as a separate fight to prepare for in advance - and he's correct.

    When you consider the burden created by enormous pension costs for police officer and firefighter services across the state, it is the single-most-important economic issue at the state level.

    In 2008, the city of Vallejo filed for bankruptcy protection after failing to negotiate new terms with its police and fire service agencies. Oakland city officials calculate that it will currently take 15 years and as much as $50 million to fulfill the city's obligations to a police and firefighter pension program that has not been used since 1970.

    Brown's first foray into the state's financial troubles represents significantly more than nipping at the fringes of state finances but is still a long way from the main event.

    Time and again Brown said during his election campaign that he would be a governor who operated on the assumption that there were no more election races to run.

    Brown's first actions as governor were bold, but not nearly bold enough - because until he unveils his plans for pension reform, he has yet to reach out and display a willingness to touch the electrified "third rail" in state politics.

    His next challenge will be taking on the practice that has allowed some police officers, firefighters and midlevel administrators to retire with six-digit pensions for the last 30 years.

    Any politician with aspirations of a future in the profession will tell you that taking on the state's public employee unions could be considered hara-kiri - its own form of honorable suicide.

    Chip Johnson's column appears in the Chronicle on Tuesday and Friday. E-mail him at chjohnson@sfchronicle.com.

    This article appeared on page C - 1 of the San Francisco Chronicle
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  15. #195
    Joined
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Kern River Valley, CA
    Age
    71
    Posts
    21,594

    Re: Let's talk California

    ^^^ Still the same old gubbnor moonbeam I remember. I guess no one should expect a leopard’s spots to change.

    Considering the mass exodus of middle class taxpayers and businesses there will soon be nobody left in California except CalPERS and illegal aliens with nobody to support them. Perhaps bankruptcy would be a good thing because the parasites that keep the socialist government in power would leave to find greener grass elsewhere. Lookout Oregon, Washington State, Nevada, Utah, Arizona and particularly Colorado they’re coming your way…

    California is another perfect example of why socialism doesn’t work. Of course the far left wouldn’t agree with the obvious.

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