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  1. #3631
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    553

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    Your smoke is wasted on me, puff it is blown away. I have a sister that is a nurse and I have talked to our local hospital administration and a close friend that is on the board of the hospital. I know what the score is, so blow your smoke to your people that will inhale it with pleasure.
    The nice thing about going to college is you learn about things like "anecdotal evidence".

    Do you have any data you can link us to that supports your assertion hospitals are closing because the uninsured can't pay their bills?

    Your hypothesis is counter intuitive due to the fact 86% of us had health insurance when Obamacare passed (so they were paying their bills) and your own assertion the cost of the non insured was being shifted to the insured.

    I don't doubt a hospital can go bankrupt like any other business due to a variety of factors, but you have presented no compelling evidence of your unlikely claims.

    http://scribeamerica.com/blog/hospitals-close/

    There are a lot of reasons hospitals close, and flat or declining insurance re-imbursements are indeed among them in the face of rising costs. However; Obamacare isn't the answer to this- Medicaid and Medicare reimbursements are notoriously low, and it's doubtful the subsidized plans of Obamacare are the high paying plans.

    http://money.cnn.com/2014/04/21/news...icare-doctors/

    Wonder why some doctors grumble when a Medicare patient walks in the door? It's likely because the government program typically pays only 80% of what private insurers do.
    Government health plans are a big part of the PROBLEM, not the solution.

    "My sister is a nurse!" doesn't really compare to facts reported in medical publications and financial magazines.
    Last edited by jethro; 10-01-2015 at 07:27 AM.

  2. #3632
    Joined
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    433

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by jethro View Post
    The nice thing about going to college is you learn about things like "anecdotal evidence".

    Do you have any data you can link us to that supports your assertion hospitals are closing because the uninsured can't pay their bills?

    Your hypothesis is counter intuitive due to the fact 86% of us had health insurance when Obamacare passed (so they were paying their bills) and your own assertion the cost of the non insured was being shifted to the insured.

    I don't doubt a hospital can go bankrupt like any other business due to a variety of factors, but you have presented no compelling evidence of your unlikely claims.

    http://scribeamerica.com/blog/hospitals-close/

    There are a lot of reasons hospitals close, and flat or declining insurance re-imbursements are indeed among them in the face of rising costs. However; Obamacare isn't the answer to this- Medicaid and Medicare reimbursements are notoriously low, and it's doubtful the subsidized plans of Obamacare are the high paying plans.

    http://money.cnn.com/2014/04/21/news...icare-doctors/



    Government health plans are a big part of the PROBLEM, not the solution.

    "My sister is a nurse!" doesn't really compare to facts reported in medical publications and financial magazines.
    Going to college you learned so much to be able to spread BS. You can put that crap over on your own people but it doesn't impress me the least. I got real world experience and know what is the real picture looks like and so does my sister who is on the front lines treating those that don't pay. The whole staff pretty much knows what is going on vs someone with smoke.

  3. #3633
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    Twain Harte, CA
    Posts
    20,453

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    Your smoke is wasted on me, puff it is blown away. I have a sister that is a nurse and I have talked to our local hospital administration and a close friend that is on the board of the hospital. I know what the score is, so blow your smoke to your people that will inhale it with pleasure.
    Going to college you learned so much to be able to spread BS. You can put that crap over on your own people but it doesn't impress me the least. I got real world experience and know what is the real picture looks like and so does my sister who is on the front lines treating those that don't pay. The whole staff pretty much knows what is going on vs someone with smoke.
    The brain power of the left is a staggering thing.

    Its about smoke.

  4. #3634
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    A Little South of Sanity
    Posts
    12,925

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    Going to college you learned so much to be able to spread BS. You can put that crap over on your own people but it doesn't impress me the least. I got real world experience and know what is the real picture looks like and so does my sister who is on the front lines treating those that don't pay. The whole staff pretty much knows what is going on vs someone with smoke.
    I believe college graduates have "Real World" experience as well. So, a Degree + Real World experience leaves you pitifully behind the power curve. Trying to subtly suggest otherwise is ludicrous.

  5. #3635
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    553

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchcedar View Post
    The brain power of the left is a staggering thing.

    Its about smoke.
    Apparently he thinks I'm some sort of carpet bagger out to trick "the common man" with my "fancy education".

    I actually wish I was wrong about this and that someone could show why there is some sense or justice in a guy working 50 hours a week in a factory having to pay more for healthcare so a streetwalker or some numb nuts who lives in his parent's basement while he's working on being the next big rap star can have a HMO.

    http://marc.merlins.org/mirrors/stuntaz/

    The way it looks to me is Obamacare is a legislated shift of wealth from people working "normal" jobs to criminals, slackers, and dumbasses.

  6. #3636
    Joined
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    433

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    The topic in this thread is "Obama's 'Public' Health Care Plan", not "Whatever Clearwater feels like being angry about".
    Last edited by Dutchcedar; 10-01-2015 at 01:29 PM.

  7. #3637
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    Twain Harte, CA
    Posts
    20,453

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by jethro View Post
    Apparently he thinks I'm some sort of carpet bagger out to trick "the common man" with my "fancy education".
    You disagree and clearly have more going on so you must a nasty, evil person. That's the long and short of it.

  8. #3638
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    A Little South of Sanity
    Posts
    12,925

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    The topic in this thread is "Obama's 'Public' Health Care Plan", not "Whatever Clearwater feels like being angry about".
    And you sir have Obama and his cronies. ROFL!!! What a joke...

  9. #3639
    Joined
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    433

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    For all the above

  10. #3640
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    A Little South of Sanity
    Posts
    12,925

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    The topic in this thread is "Obama's 'Public' Health Care Plan", not "Whatever Clearwater feels like being angry about".
    That's questionable.

  11. #3641
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    553

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    For all the above
    Are you on Obamacare Clearwater?

  12. #3642
    Joined
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    10,812

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Clearwater View Post
    The topic in this thread is "Obama's 'Public' Health Care Plan", not "Whatever Clearwater feels like being angry about".
    Love to see what this post actually stated before:
    Last edited by Dutchcedar; 10-01-2015 at 01:29 PM.
    Glad it you laughed about it, Clearwater.
    Thomas Jefferson to John Page Fairfeilds Dec: 25. 1762.
    ... But the old-fellows say we must read to gain knowledge; and gain knowledge to make us happy and be admired. Mere jargon! Is there any such thing as happiness in this world? No: And as for admiration I am sure the man who powders most, parfumes most, embroiders most, and talks most nonsense, is most admired.

  13. #3643
    Joined
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    10,812

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by jethro View Post
    The nice thing about going to college is you learn about things like "anecdotal evidence".

    Do you have any data you can link us to that supports your assertion hospitals are closing because the uninsured can't pay their bills?

    Your hypothesis is counter intuitive due to the fact 86% of us had health insurance when Obamacare passed (so they were paying their bills) and your own assertion the cost of the non insured was being shifted to the insured.

    I don't doubt a hospital can go bankrupt like any other business due to a variety of factors, but you have presented no compelling evidence of your unlikely claims.

    http://scribeamerica.com/blog/hospitals-close/

    There are a lot of reasons hospitals close, and flat or declining insurance re-imbursements are indeed among them in the face of rising costs. However; Obamacare isn't the answer to this- Medicaid and Medicare reimbursements are notoriously low, and it's doubtful the subsidized plans of Obamacare are the high paying plans.

    http://money.cnn.com/2014/04/21/news...icare-doctors/



    Government health plans are a big part of the PROBLEM, not the solution.

    "My sister is a nurse!" doesn't really compare to facts reported in medical publications and financial magazines.
    Hmm, sounds a lot like "I know someone who owns a truck and had their rates go up $300 bucks" to me. Yes it is called "anecdotal evidence".

    Something like what you do, especially with this argument:
    Quote Originally Posted by jethro View Post
    Apparently he thinks I'm some sort of carpet bagger out to trick "the common man" with my "fancy education".

    I actually wish I was wrong about this and that someone could show why there is some sense or justice in a guy working 50 hours a week in a factory having to pay more for healthcare so a streetwalker or some numb nuts who lives in his parent's basement while he's working on being the next big rap star can have a HMO.

    http://marc.merlins.org/mirrors/stuntaz/


    The way it looks to me is Obamacare is a legislated shift of wealth from people working "normal" jobs to criminals, slackers, and dumbasses.
    You're certainly entitled to an opinion. But let's face it, this argument of yours is less than anecdotal. You have no idea how these kids are covered and by whom.

    Btw, interesting post from http://scribeamerica.com/blog/hospitals-close/.
    He uses old data related to closings that predate the ACA, stating the ACA is new.
    He goes on to list Unions as one of the issues, not talking about Doctors salaries as a cost of doing business. Then he links to a post about the data change that is in progress with the conclusion that:
    5. Breathe deep, and dive in

    Physicians now have a 1-year grace period until full implementation, but hospitals and other facilities must be fully ready on October 1. ICD-10 represents the global standard for medical coding and record-keeping, and itís high time the United States caught up. The sooner you take the plunge, the sooner itíll all become second nature.
    My point here is that I don't expect to change your opinion. It is a complicated issue that has many factors. The impact of defaults from those not covered are one and arguing that it is anecdotal does not discount the fact that defaults from those without coverage utilizing the ER system for care that could be done with less cost, and with coverage that guarantees payment to the hospitals is a factor in why Heritage made this a conservative concept before Obama took it on.

    Now you guys relish in constant liberal dismissal. OK.
    Thomas Jefferson to John Page Fairfeilds Dec: 25. 1762.
    ... But the old-fellows say we must read to gain knowledge; and gain knowledge to make us happy and be admired. Mere jargon! Is there any such thing as happiness in this world? No: And as for admiration I am sure the man who powders most, parfumes most, embroiders most, and talks most nonsense, is most admired.

  14. #3644
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    A Little South of Sanity
    Posts
    12,925

    Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by otoc View Post
    .........My point here is that I don't expect to change your opinion............Now you guys relish in constant liberal dismissal. OK.
    Right you are - that should make it about time to move on.....

  15. #3645
    Joined
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    7,743

    Angry Re: Obama's "Public" Health Care Plan

    Just got my annual price increase notice.
    A whopping 60% increase in premiums with doubling deductibles and Max Out of Pocket.

    So here I go shopping for frigging health insurance again. Screw it, cheapest plan I can get with an HSA.

    Tyan S5397 2x X5450 16GB - SuperMicro H8DCI 2x 275 8GB - Iwill DK8X 2x Opteron 250 2GB


    Take a Kid FISHING!

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