Hero or Zero

[AeroSim]

I was simply stating my opinion. If this asshat is tried and convicted of a capital offense execution should be his punishment. In my opinion this guy has evidently done one of the worst criminal acts that can be perpetrated during time of war. If the allegations are true he endangered the lives of every man and women serving in Iraq and Afghanistan. The thing that really pisses me off is the fact this guy has a cushy job far, far from danger and for whatever reason he endangers the very people he’s supposed to protect.

Calling Asange press is like calling Hitler Dr. Kevorkian…

I hear that. I'd even save the government money.

Lotsa guys I don't care for in the press and lotsa stuff I don't care for in the public domain. But the Constitution was not written so I can have my way or satisfy what my concept of fair is. I don't care for gag orders either.

The reason I say that is because government is growing out of control and is starting to use all this silencing to gag anything that is even remotely embarrassing and permitting it and the banks to dump countless trillions you and I don't know where.

But most importantly, if Assange never had the the information in the first place....

If I remember right, deterrence worked real well in the military.

Aero whistles away ......

[Phopojijo]

Another thing to consider is it’s asshats like those at Wikileaks that will bring government regulation and control to the internet.

Actually I'll go back to one of the comments Tucker made earlier (quoted above) along the same lines of what AeroSim was saying.

It seems very nonsensical to me to, in attempting to avoid Government regulation of journalism (apparently)... pretend that the Government always had the legal right to censor what they feel like under (especially false) grounds of national security.

[tucker]

Actually I'll go back to one of the comments Tucker made earlier (quoted above) along the same lines of what AeroSim was saying.

It seems very nonsensical to me to, in attempting to avoid Government regulation of journalism (apparently)... pretend that the Government always had the legal right to censor what they feel like under (especially false) grounds of national security.

Look nobody likes government secrets or censorship but the facts are every major country in the world has security and security agencies. It sure would be great if we lived in a world of transparency but the facts are there are still some very evil people out there that want to take everything that belongs to you including your life. Like it or not National Defense requires secrecy and censorship and that cannot be denied.

The censorship I was talking about is the kind that doesn’t affect the bad guys and asshats it’s the kind of censorship that goes after the average user.

[JustinC939]

Spot on Ron....

[tucker]

Talk about the epitome of irony and hypocrisy…

Irony

Irony alert: Julian Assange complains about leaked police report
The WikiLeaks founder — no stranger to the leaking of documents — cries foul as humiliating details of his alleged sexual assaults are leaked to the British media

posted on December 20, 2010, at 11:01 AM

Julian Assange's lawyers say the leaked alleged sex crimes documents are just "trying to make Julian look bad.

The irony: Julian Assange, who orchestrated the leaking of thousands of embarrassing diplomatic cables to the press via his WikiLeaks website, has received a taste of his own medicine — and he doesn't like it. After police reports on his alleged sex crimes in Sweden were leaked to The Guardian over the weekend, Assange's lawyers demanded an official investigation, saying they can only imagine one motive behind the leaks: "Trying to make Julian look bad." In one of the leaked reports, Assange's sexual performance is described as "the world's worst screw." In a further ironic twist, The Guardian was one of the few newspapers given exclusive access to WikiLeaks' trove of diplomatic cables.
The reaction: "It would be hard to imagine a richer irony," says an unsigned editorial in The New York Sun, than the "founder of a Web site dedicated to the leaking of classified government documents" complaining about the leak of a confidential report. That old saying about glass houses and throwing stones comes to mind. Uh, not exactly, says Jeremy Sapienza at AntiWar.com. WikiLeaks aims to expose the misdeeds of the "nearly invincible elites," not betray the confidences of "accused and assumed innocent individuals" like Assange. The WikiLeaks founder "is not now, in any way, hoist by his own petard, thank you."

http://theweek.com/article/index/210...de36d2c331b3,0

[Phopojijo]

The reaction: "It would be hard to imagine a richer irony," says an unsigned editorial in The New York Sun, than the "founder of a Web site dedicated to the leaking of classified government documents" complaining about the leak of a confidential report. That old saying about glass houses and throwing stones comes to mind. Uh, not exactly, says Jeremy Sapienza at AntiWar.com. WikiLeaks aims to expose the misdeeds of the "nearly invincible elites," not betray the confidences of "accused and assumed innocent individuals" like Assange. The WikiLeaks founder "is not now, in any way, hoist by his own petard, thank you."

That's a very odd and unsettling thing to have outside of quotation marks.

[Meridian]

Talk about the epitome of irony and hypocrisy…

Really? Care to point me at a wikileak involving sub-judice court records?


M

[JustinC939]

I think it's awful funny how all of these accusation of condom breakage, and past sexual assaults just start coming out of the woodwork just as the %%%%s hitting the fan over Wikileaks.

We are a very gullible nation.

As far as I'm concerned, the truth is not treason. Nobody has died over the leaks of this information, yet people die everyday for government lies. I'm not gonna wrap myself in a flag and live a lie for the sake of national security.

The Watergate scandal among other things were uncovered as a result of leaked information. The real solution to this problem is not a witch hunt, but a reform of our entire governmental system.

[tucker]

I think it's awful funny how all of these accusation of condom breakage, and past sexual assaults just start coming out of the woodwork just as the %%%%s hitting the fan over Wikileaks.

We are a very gullible nation.

As far as I'm concerned, the truth is not treason. Nobody has died over the leaks of this information, yet people die everyday for government lies. I'm not gonna wrap myself in a flag and live a lie for the sake of national security.

The Watergate scandal among other things were uncovered as a result of leaked information. The real solution to this problem is not a witch hunt, but a reform of our entire governmental system.

My, my…Was it something I said that drew such testy reactions…

If you’re so convinced Assange is innocent I’m sure you would be the first to erge him to cowboy up and face the charges in court.

As far as I'm concerned, the truth is not treason. Nobody has died over the leaks of this information, yet people die everyday for government lies. I'm not gonna wrap myself in a flag and live a lie for the sake of national security.

As far as I’m concerned the truth is treason when it puts 1000s of people in jeopardy. By the way how do you know some of those documents weren’t altered as a matter of fact how do you know they’re all the truth. How would you know nobody has died because of the leaks? Which lies are causing people to die every day?

I have a felling you wouldn’t wrap yourself in the flag for any reason and certainly not for national security. It’s not about patriotism it’s about the difference between right and wrong.

People like Abbie Hoffman, Jerry Rubin, Allen Ginsberg, Donald Sutherland, Jane Fonda, Tom Hayden, and John Kerry all liked to think they didn’t get people killed… They most certainly did...

The Watergate scandal among other things were uncovered as a result of leaked information. The real solution to this problem is not a witch hunt, but a reform of our entire governmental system

Watergate and the Assange leaks are two different animals. Watergate started in 1972 and ended in 1974 weren’t you a wee bit young then.

I’m all with you on total government reform but not by endangering the messengers of war. Go after the message senders they are the ones responsible for everything.

btw... You're still my hero...

Meridian
Really? Care to point me at a wikileak involving sub-judice court records?

Oh now we’re getting picky about kinds of leaks. I don’t know what it’s like in England but here in the US leaking court records is a common tactic amoung both prosecutors and defense attorneys.

Assange is a mighty bold fellow when it’s somebody else’s life on the line but he is a whiny baby when it’s his ass on the line.

[JustinC939]

My, my…Was it something I said that drew such testy reactions…

No, I think it was something I said that drew your reaction because I knew, I KNEW! that you'd be the first one back after you saw that I had the last response to this thread...

If you’re so convinced Assange is innocent I’m sure you would be the first to erge him to cowboy up and face the charges in court.

We'll see if he even gets a fair trial.
The man is being charged with Rape because a condom broke during sex. It was so absurd that the prosecute originally threw it out. Later however, the guy above him decided to proceed with the charges and take the case to court. How does that not strike anyone as being the least bit starange that these stories just start seeing light as Wiki Leaks is releasing bombshell documents?

As far as I’m concerned the truth is treason when it puts 1000s of people in jeopardy. By the way how do you know some of those documents weren’t altered as a matter of fact how do you know they’re all the truth. How would you know nobody has died because of the leaks? Which lies are causing people to die every day?

Ok,

How do you know the documents weren't altered?
How do you know that the documents put anyone in jeopardy?
BTW, I haven't heard anyone in government denying the integrity of the information contained in the leaked docs.

I have a felling you wouldn’t wrap yourself in the flag for any reason and certainly not for national security. It’s not about patriotism it’s about the difference between right and wrong.

We'll talk about right and wrong in a second
[/quote]

People like Abbie Hoffman, Jerry Rubin, Allen Ginsberg, Donald Sutherland, Jane Fonda, Tom Hayden, and John Kerry all liked to think they didn’t get people killed… They most certainly did...

So does the U.S. government.

Watergate and the Assange leaks are two different animals. Watergate started in 1972 and ended in 1974 weren’t you a wee bit young then.

Ok, so what does the duration of the event, the year in which it occured, or when I was born have anything to do with this? Just another pointless argument.
If someone broke into my house and found evidence towards me being guilty of a murder, would I be let off the hook because the evidence was illegally obtained? Would that change the fact that I was guilty.
Explain how these leaks are putting any of us in danger? How can you sit there and defend the lies that were responsible for tens of thousands of deaths, but condemn the messenger for exposing the truth that supposedly puts us in danger? Give me a break.....

I’m all with you on total government reform but not by endangering the messengers of war. Go after the message senders they are the ones responsible for everything.

Everything huh?

btw... You're still my hero...

Nice to know I have admirers.

Which lies are causing people to die every day?

In the leaks, it was discovered that no Al Qaeda existed in Iraq prior to 9/11, yet we went to war based on the lie that it did, and/or that god told him to go to war Iraq. Or something more recent not related to WL but a lie no less; when the government told the 9/11 first responders that the air was safe to breathe only to find out that it was not.
Or how about when •••• Cheney ordered NORAD to stand down when he knew hijacked planes were still in the air?

Compare that death toll against the supposed thousands of lives that wiki leaks puts in jeopardy


This isn't about National Secutiy, it's about maintaining an empire of corruption and lies. The truth is not some sort of abstract concept, it is what it is and choosing to believe and defend lies for the sake of patriotism does not change the fact that they are lies.
I personally would rather know the truth and face the dangers because that's what being brave and free really is.

Einstein said "A foolish faith in authority is the enemy of truth." Now what do you think Einstein saw in his lifetime that inspired him to say those words?

[Enmore]

Seems it was lefty British rag The Guardian who pestered Julian Assange into giving them access to the leaked documents. They then covered their arses shared them with the NY Times in the US and Der Spiegel in Germany.

[Enmore]

From The Guardian: Who says the CIA doesn't have a sense of humour:

WTF? OMG, LOL! CIA gives WikiLeaks taskforce naughty name

US spy agency forms taskforce to assess fallout from 250,000 leaked US cables

The CIA has launched a taskforce to assess the impact of 250,000 leaked US diplomatic cables. Its name? WikiLeaks Task Force, or WTF for short.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010...-taskforce-wtf

[tucker]

No, I think it was something I said that drew your reaction because I knew, I KNEW! that you'd be the first one back after you saw that I had the last response to this thread...

You got me?

I ate your lunch!

I knew as soon as you saw that post you, Meridian and Phopojijo would be falling all over each other in the rush to get to the post button first. You didn’t disappoint… I was done with this thread until I saw that story on the news. I just couldn’t resist jerking your chain. Hell I even let you guys stew for a day before I replied.

After the same thing is said 4 or 5 times it starts getting a little bit monotonous so I’ll declare me the winner of this debate and I’ll move on to something else now…

[JustinC939]

^^I was in such a rush to post in this thread to get back at you that I waited until the 5th page before I started making my argument.

But as you can see, I back up my stance with facts and numbers, so just wave your silly victory flag around while conveniently ignoring my rebuttal since you can't refute it

[Enmore]

Bye bye sleezoid.

Julian Assange must be extradited, judge rules

WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange should be extradited to Sweden for alleged sex offences, a judge has ruled.

24 Feb 2011

District Judge Howard Riddle rejected the defence's claims that their client could not get a fair trial because of media coverage and even comments by the country's Prime Minister in Parliament.

The 39-year-old Australian faces three charges of sexually assaulting one woman and one charge of raping another during a week-long visit to Stockholm in August.

During a two-and-a-half-day extradition hearing earlier this month at Belmarsh Magistrates' Court in south London, Assange's lawyers argued that if he were sent to Sweden he would be likely to face a ''secret'' trial held behind closed doors.

They have also claimed extradition would breach his human rights and say he could ultimately be taken against his will to the United States and executed.

Assange now has one week to appeal to the High Court. He denies committing any offences and his supporters claim the criminal inquiry and extradition request are unfair and politically motivated.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...dge-rules.html