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  1. #196
    Joined
    May 2002
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    Twain Harte, CA
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    20,424

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Activate: AMD View Post
    My point was that I don't understand why people think its a big deal, but thanks for the mind-blowing insight there dutch
    Sometimes it seems people need the obvious explained.

    As for the lawsuits, thats a really hollow argument.
    Well now, you said you "don't think homosexuals are trying to force churches to perform ceremonies." But that simply isn't true. Lawsuits have been filed to force churches to perform same sex marriages. There isn't anything hollow about it.

  2. #197
    Joined
    Sep 2003
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    Kern River Valley, CA
    Age
    71
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    21,506

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by no2guncntrl View Post
    I couldn't care less, but it does
    freak me out to see a guy or gal laying a big fat smooch the lips of their partner
    in public. To me, that's just mighty strange and I have to look the other way.

    As a heterosexual white male it does give me a bit of an uneasy feeling when I see gays or lesbians sucking face in public. It’s similar to the feeling I get when my brothers toy poodle tries to hump my leg.

    I don’t think there’s anything bigoted about it. It’s a natural heterosexual reaction. Of course I haven’t had the politically correct indoctrination many have gone through.

    Yeppers, I do have gay friends and family members too but they don’t think it’s a necessary requirement to suck face in public. As a matter of fact my heterosexual friends and family don’t think it’s a requirement to swap spit in public either.

    Personally I really don’t care if it’s marriage or civil unions as long as there are equal rights. I guess equal rights are the main objective. I can’t understand why anybody would want to ruin a perfectly good relationship with a marriage certificate anyway.
    Last edited by tucker; 05-11-2012 at 12:38 PM.

  3. #198
    Joined
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Corruptfornia
    Posts
    3,785

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    My apologies. I singled out your post because it was the last one and then proceeded to go off on my own little tangent where I wasn't really directly responding
    Well, thanks. I appreciate it. I wasn't sure what I did to lite ya off, but it's all good
    as far as I'm concerned.

  4. #199
    Joined
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Colorafornia, USSA
    Age
    46
    Posts
    13,817

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Activate: AMD View Post
    I'm not really sure I understand what the hangup is in people's minds when I hear "i'm for civil unions, but not marriages!" I don't think homosexuals are trying to force churches to perform ceremonies.. they're just looking for the protections of law given to "marriages". After all, on the governmental level isn't a marriage just a "union" since they're treated the same no matter how they're performed.
    Ah, but they will. No sooner will gays receive the ability to get married, they will attack the churches for not marrying them. This is exactly the reason they don't like the idea of civil unions, which imo makes the most sense. If they legalize gay marriage and gays get married via justice of the peace or any other non-religious institution, I'd also be fine with that. I just know though that this still wouldn't be enough for them, and nothing would change but the thread title here. It would read "Why can't gays get married in a church?"

  5. #200
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,265

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by kbohip View Post
    Ah, but they will. No sooner will gays receive the ability to get married, they will attack the churches for not marrying them. This is exactly the reason they don't like the idea of civil unions, which imo makes the most sense. If they legalize gay marriage and gays get married via justice of the peace or any other non-religious institution, I'd also be fine with that. I just know though that this still wouldn't be enough for them, and nothing would change but the thread title here. It would read "Why can't gays get married in a church?"
    ^^^ That's probably one of the biggest rubs for me and I'm not religious, anti-gay or a homophobe. That they reject "civil unions" and seem to want to force churches to marry same sex couples against their beliefs.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  6. #201
    Joined
    Aug 2001
    Posts
    74,682

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Wow. Read some of this. So maybe the politics wasnt really so smart of Obama?

    http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/142867/

  7. #202
    Joined
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Central NJ
    Posts
    11,090

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by AMDScooter View Post
    ^^^ That's probably one of the biggest rubs for me and I'm not religious, anti-gay or a homophobe. That they reject "civil unions" and seem to want to force churches to marry same sex couples against their beliefs.
    well then they need to get a clue, if that is indeed the majority opinion. A compromise isn't really a compromise if only one side is making the concessions. Still, I would hesitate to use a "slippery slope" type argument to rationalize not issuing civil unions because homosexuals might use them as a springboard to sue churches. I'm not convinced that the majority of homosexuals are demanding anything more than the same basic legal protections that normal hetero couples enjoy. There is the vocal minority demanding ludicrous things, but there always is. Focusing on them is diversionary.


    Trust me, I do science
    My Hardware, Past and Present

  8. #203
    Joined
    Mar 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26,265

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Activate: AMD View Post
    well then they need to get a clue, if that is indeed the majority opinion. A compromise isn't really a compromise if only one side is making the concessions. Still, I would hesitate to use a "slippery slope" type argument to rationalize not issuing civil unions because homosexuals might use them as a springboard to sue churches. I'm not convinced that the majority of homosexuals are demanding anything more than the same basic legal protections that normal hetero couples enjoy. There is the vocal minority demanding ludicrous things, but there always is. Focusing on them is diversionary.
    I think the LGBT community would get far more support for a civil union bill that mirrors all the positives and negatives of traditional marriages. IMHO it'd pass and they must know that by now. But that does not appear to be what they want.. they want marriage to be redefined instead. Same sex marriage has been shot down at state level every time, even in the most liberal states. And I seriously doubt it's because they are pushing for anything less than "marriage". At least that's what I see from here on the left coast in the SF Bay Area.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  9. #204
    Joined
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Indian-uhhh
    Age
    38
    Posts
    5,807

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    From what I've heard, marriage is a civil institution, which would me that the government can allow anyone can be married.

    Having said that, if that's the case, it is what it is. It would be a push to say that religious organizations that don't agree with homosexuality must marry them. In all honesty, that would be a very bad move because it would be seen as telling a religion what to believe directly from the state.

    I've said it before, because of my beliefs I am opposed to it, but I recognize that the US is a secular state, meaning there is no official state religion.

  10. #205
    Joined
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    644

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Activate: AMD View Post
    Still, I would hesitate to use a "slippery slope" type argument to rationalizejustify not issuing civil unions because homosexuals might use them as a springboard to sue churches.
    Forcing a church to perform a marriage outside of their beliefs is as much of a violation of its freedom as telling a homosexual couple that they cannot be married is a violation of theirs.

    And using either as an excuse for the other is hypocritical o.O
    Last edited by Phopojijo; 05-12-2012 at 04:12 AM.

  11. #206
    Joined
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,358

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchcedar View Post
    The simple answer is that it has tax consequences. But maybe not. I wonder if we had an income tax system before the government had its definition of marriage. I just don't know.
    Are the tax consequences somehow different for 'civil unions'?

  12. #207
    Joined
    May 2002
    Location
    Twain Harte, CA
    Posts
    20,424

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pehu View Post
    Are the tax consequences somehow different for 'civil unions'?
    I don't know. I s'pose they could be. "Married filing jointly" probably isn't available.

  13. #208
    Joined
    Jun 2004
    Location
    In a house
    Posts
    5,755

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    This issue is all about forcing people to accept their behavior as normal. Thats why the Civil union approach with all the same bennies isn't going to work.

  14. #209
    Joined
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,358

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by /\/\adGamer View Post
    This issue is all about forcing people to accept their behavior as normal.
    I just don't get it... Your point that is... Is 'normal' something defined by the government? Do you do something that you might think is not normal and if so then do you think the government should ban it?

  15. #210
    Joined
    Jun 2004
    Location
    In a house
    Posts
    5,755

    Re: Gay Marriage/Gay Rights/Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pehu View Post
    I just don't get it...
    Actually I think you do in fact "get it".

    we can also substitute the word "normal" with "natural" if you like!Furthermore if you still don't "get it" Feel free to look up the words Normal or Natural that might help.

    if someone reads back far enough they will see I am all for civil unions, I just don't believe two people of the same sex can be "married" since I believe marriage is between one man and one woman
    Last edited by /\/\adGamer; 05-15-2012 at 06:50 PM.

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