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  1. #196
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    with their imagination, it's easy to see how iraq became one big cluster ...........


    bb

  2. #197
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    A small update on an aspect of this story we don't hear much about:

    Obama heroically vowed the perpetrators of the Benghazi attack will be hunted down and brought to justice.

    He's as far along in his quest as O.J. Simpson's crack team in pursuit of the killers of Nicole and Ron Goldman.

  3. #198
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Perhaps we should bomb something completely unrrelated.

    I remember once when a bunch of Saudis attacked us, we blew up two other countries with people that looked the same. Went well.

  4. #199
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackDragon24 View Post
    Perhaps we should bomb something completely unrrelated.

    I remember once when a bunch of Saudis attacked us, we blew up two other countries with people that looked the same. Went well.
    Yup.. cuz nuthin is better than dragging that strawman out for another flogging. Remember way back when you lefties used to whine incessantly that one of those was the "good" war the other was a "distraction" from? Remember how you guys tried your darndest to keep us from winning one of them? And Booosh won anyway? Then you elected a clueless wonder to execute the "good" war only to find out the best he could come up with was retreat? I also remember once a whole lotta congresscritters from your side of the isle authorized both them wars.. so I can see why you'd whine incessantly about BOOOOSH.
    "The most dangerous myth is the demagoguery that business can be made to pay a larger share, thus relieving the individual. Politicians preaching this are either deliberately dishonest, or economically illiterate, and either one should scare us...
    Only people pay taxes, and people pay as consumers every tax that is assessed against a business."


    -The Gipper


  5. #200
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackDragon24 View Post
    Perhaps we should bomb something completely unrrelated.

    I remember once when a bunch of Saudis attacked us, we blew up two other countries with people that looked the same. Went well.
    And you talked trash at me because I backed Ron Paul....really? I would definitely agree with you on Iraq. That was a nice big hornet's nest we didn't need to go sticking our hands in. Afghanistan otoh was completely necessary as that's where Al Qaeda was mostly based at.

  6. #201
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by AMDScooter View Post
    Yup.. cuz nuthin is better than dragging that strawman out for another flogging. Remember way back when you lefties used to whine incessantly that one of those was the "good" war the other was a "distraction" from? Remember how you guys tried your darndest to keep us from winning one of them? And Booosh won anyway? Then you elected a clueless wonder to execute the "good" war only to find out the best he could come up with was retreat? I also remember once a whole lotta congresscritters from your side of the isle authorized both them wars.. so I can see why you'd whine incessantly about BOOOOSH.
    Two wars was the response of Bush "heroically vowing the perpetrators of the 9/11 attack will be hunted down and brought to justice."

    Just sayin'

    I wasn't the one doin' the bitchin'....talk to your partner in crime who compared Obama to OJ.

  7. #202
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    Red face Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by AMDScooter View Post
    Yup.. cuz nuthin is better than dragging that strawman out for another flogging. Remember way back when you lefties used to whine incessantly that one of those was the "good" war the other was a "distraction" from? Remember how you guys tried your darndest to keep us from winning one of them? And Booosh won anyway? Then you elected a clueless wonder to execute the "good" war only to find out the best he could come up with was retreat? I also remember once a whole lotta congresscritters from your side of the isle authorized both them wars.. so I can see why you'd whine incessantly about BOOOOSH.
    Oh my. I had to read this several times to see if this rant was devoid of reality or just an amplification of a half truth taken that extra mile into your typical absolute conclusion.

    Putting aside your argument of "my strawman is more preposterous than yours" since this was something bd didn't initiate, I remember a totally different scenario. One where bush lied using the simpleton logic you guys now use. A real lie. Thanks for envolking his name. Appreciate it as much as you imagine discussion as whining when your eyes and ears are closed to different opinions, something we have all made a running joke around here. At least the mouth is working by way of your keyboard and I hope you feel better while we all thank you for for this typical display where you can't seem to find words on the actual topic.

    Please carry on, my reaction to your reentry here is complete. Yeah I know, I'm a monkey, I'm green, and I've posted on other sites. I've heard it before.
    Thomas Jefferson to John Page Fairfeilds Dec: 25. 1762.
    ... But the old-fellows say we must read to gain knowledge; and gain knowledge to make us happy and be admired. Mere jargon! Is there any such thing as happiness in this world? No: And as for admiration I am sure the man who powders most, parfumes most, embroiders most, and talks most nonsense, is most admired.

  8. #203
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    How the guy who added the words, "State Department" got flipped into a counter scandal...

    the Democratic advocacy group Media Matters—which is always mysteriously in sync with the administration despite ostensibly operating independently—has launched a smear campaign against ABC News reporter Jonathan Karl for his reporting on Benghazi. It’s the kind of character assassination that would make Joseph McCarthy blush. The main page of the Media Matters website has six stories attacking Karl for a single mistake in an otherwise correct report about the State Department's myriad changes to talking points they previously claimed to have barely touched. See, the problem isn’t the repeated obfuscating from the administration about the Benghazi attack; the problem is Jonathan Karl. Hence, the now-familiar campaign of de-legitimization. This gross media intimidation is courtesy of tax-deductable donations from the Democratic Party’s liberal donor base, which provides a whopping $20 million a year for Media Matters to harass reporters who won’t fall in line.

    In what is surely just a huge coincidence, the liberal media monitoring organization Fairness and Accuracy in the Media (FAIR) is also on a quest to delegitimize Karl. It dug through his past and discovered that in college he allegedly—horrors!—associated with conservatives. Because of this, FAIR declared Karl “a right wing mole at ABC News.” Setting aside the veracity of FAIR’s crazy claim, isn’t the fact that it was made in the first place vindication for those who assert a liberal media bias in the mainstream media? If the existence of a person who allegedly associates with conservatives is a “mole,” then what does that tell us about the rest of the media?
    Ya gotta follow in goose steps.

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...the-press.html

    Edit: The conjured up "Republicans Lied!!!" counter scandal gets three Pinocchios from the Post.

    OJ's and Obama's suspects are still at large.


    -
    Last edited by Dutchcedar; 05-21-2013 at 09:42 AM.

  9. #204
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchcedar View Post
    How the guy who added the words, "State Department" got flipped into a counter scandal...



    Ya gotta follow in goose steps.

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...the-press.html
    I'll give you some genius insight Dutch.

    It's not the fact that he mis-reported.

    It's that he's acting as if his mis-reporting is no big deal....that it didn't change the story completely....much like you did yesterday.

    Same analogy as yesterday. "So other than all that, how did you like the play Mrs. Lincoln?"

  10. #205
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by otoc View Post
    Oh my. I had to read this several times to see if this rant was devoid of reality or just an amplification of a half truth taken that extra mile into your typical absolute conclusion.

    Putting aside your argument of "my strawman is more preposterous than yours" since this was something bd didn't initiate, I remember a totally different scenario. One where bush lied using the simpleton logic you guys now use. A real lie. Thanks for envolking his name. Appreciate it as much as you imagine discussion as whining when your eyes and ears are closed to different opinions, something we have all made a running joke around here. At least the mouth is working by way of your keyboard and I hope you feel better while we all thank you for for this typical display where you can't seem to find words on the actual topic.

    Please carry on, my reaction to your reentry here is complete. Yeah I know, I'm a monkey, I'm green, and I've posted on other sites. I've heard it before.
    It's gone from comic relief to tragedy, unfortunately.

  11. #206
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackDragon24 View Post
    I'll give you some genius insight Dutch.

    It's not the fact that he mis-reported.

    It's that he's acting as if his mis-reporting is no big deal....that it didn't change the story completely....much like you did yesterday.

    Same analogy as yesterday. "So other than all that, how did you like the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
    Clearly, you either did not read the links, especially the Pinocchio one, or you march in goose steps. Its one or the other. You'll have to explain how his reporting "changed the story completely". It simply did not.

    After reading about this carefully, I just don't see it any other way.

    In particular, Karl quotes Deputy National Security Adviser Ben Rhodes as writing late on the evening of Sept. 14:

    “We must make sure that the talking points reflect all agency equities, including those of the State Department, and we don’t want to undermine the FBI investigation. We thus will work through the talking points tomorrow morning at the Deputies Committee meeting.”

    On May 13, CNN obtained the actual e-mail written by Rhodes, which said:

    “We need to resolve this in a way that respects all of the relevant equities, particularly the investigation….We can take this up tomorrow morning at deputies.”
    Pay close attention to the very important fact that the State Department absolutely was one of the "relevant entities" and at best should not have been singled out. In other words, both versions say essentially the same thing, just with different emphasis. With the largest stretch, neither is false in any way shape or form.

    Neither conjure up anything out of whole cloth, like a video, as a cause for anything. The only thing fabricated out of whole cloth here is the controversy, and for anyone paying attention to the truth instead of Media Matters spin, its debunked.

    So at best, you can haggle over his depiction of the e-mail as being an accurate transcription or a summary... which also doesn't rise to the level of a scandal, let alone a national scandal.

    Its a... squirrel!!!
    Last edited by BlackDragon24; 05-21-2013 at 10:16 AM. Reason: Whoops...accidently hit edit instead of quote :)

  12. #207
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Clearly I didn't read the pinocchio links because they were put in after I wrote my response.

    I'll agree with you and the post on one thing. The e-mails weren't doctored. That implies forgery.

    Other than that, this quote pretty much stands:

    Yes, Karl's original story may have seemed like it was interesting—but only if you weren't actually paying attention to the substance. The thing that made it seem interesting was that the White House supposedly had weighed in on behalf of the State Department to cover up information suggesting that terrorists, potentially linked to al Qaeda, were suspected of participating in the attack. Of course, as we now know from the actual emails, that never happened, but you didn't need the actual emails to understand that point.

  13. #208
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    ^^^ That quote may well "stand" in someone's mind, but neither the actual e-mail or the summarized one make any false representation of who its from, as your quote suggests. Neither reference a cover up, as your quote suggests, and neither reference Al Qaeda or a potential link to them. Finally, the actual e-mail tells no different story, as your quote suggests.

    So in your mind, Kos may be spot on, but you have to do an awful lot of reading between the lines and fabricating out of whole cloth for it to be so.

    That's not to say that any of that isn't in the larger story, as all three points certainly exist, but none are part of this conjured up e-mail controversy, scandal, or squirrel.

  14. #209
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchcedar View Post
    ^^^ That quote may well "stand" in someone's mind, but neither the actual e-mail or the summarized one make any false representation of who its from, as your quote suggests. Neither reference a cover up, as your quote suggests, and neither reference Al Qaeda or a potential link to them. Finally, the actual e-mail tells no different story, as your quote suggests.

    So in your mind, Kos may be spot on, but you have to do an awful lot of reading between the lines and fabricating out of whole cloth for it to be so.

    That's not to say that any of that isn't in the larger story, as all three points certainly exist, but none are part of this conjured up e-mail controversy, scandal, or squirrel.
    Dutch....your so worried about pointing out squirrels that you can't see the squirrel right in front of your face.

    What was the point of the report by Karl? He or his republican source purposefully added language to emphasize state's involvement. They also purposefully added language to make it look like State was covering up the fact that Al Qaeda might have been involved. Right wing media circus ensues. White House calls the BS bluff and releases the e-mails showing what exactly was said. If you can't see this as a coordinated attack between a BS republican source who leaked bad info to a willing accomplice in the press, then I have a story to sell you about a youtube video that started a protest in Benghazi.

    And then after it was debunked? He just carried on as if nothing happened.

    But Media Matters? Those guys would make McCarthy blush for pointing this out

    Carry on.
    Last edited by BlackDragon24; 05-21-2013 at 11:34 AM.

  15. #210
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    Re: Libya: The Entire Hideous Mess

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackDragon24 View Post
    Dutch....your so worried about pointing out squirrels that you can't see the squirrel right in front of your face.

    What was the point of the report by Karl? He or his republican source purposefully added language to emphasize state's involvement. They also purposefully added language to make it look like State was covering up the fact that Al Qaeda might have been involved. Right wing media circus ensues. White House calls the BS bluff and releases the e-mails showing what exactly was said. If you can't see this as a coordinated attack between a BS republican source who leaked bad info to a willing accomplice in the press, then I have a story to sell you about a youtube video that started a protest in Benghazi.

    And then after it was debunked? He just carried on as if nothing happened.

    But Media Matters? Those guys would make McCarthy blush for pointing this out

    Carry on.
    I have squirrels, you have a conspiracy theory.

    Added language? C'mon. "State Department". That's your "added language". And it doesn't change anything whether its there or not. Read the two examples. Whether one calls out State or not changes nothing.

    See here: "...all agency equities, including those of the State Department..." Is your point that if they were not called out specifically, they would would not be included? Are they not one of the "agency equities"? Of course they are. They both say the same damned thing. If the original said "except the State Department", you might have something.

    I'll give ya this, but its a stretch. Maybe, by calling out State specifically, the pointer is directed their way for a not so careful reader. We now know Al Qaeda's involvement was covered up. We also know the video as a cause is bulldung. But to say that this error that was made without the actual e-mail in hand, was done intentionally to point the finger of blame at the State Department... I s'pose its possible that was there, but certainly not proven. Maybe Karl met with Karl Rove before hand, who didn't know Media Matters was on the hunt for a counter conspiracy theory for Benghazi.

    What would be the motive? Its not like it would point blame at Hillary (that might be a reason), because like Barrack, she states she was "out of the loop". Who cares which agency is portrayed at playing the heavier hand in rewriting these talking points? Apparently, the folks at Kos care quite a bit. Why?

    Where's the truth? Why is it being hidden? Why are all of the e-mails not released? What's the big secret? Why the cover-up? We know all the agency equities, included those of the State Department, are involved in keeping the secrets from the American public.

    Nixonian.

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